CIS: Carbohydrate intolerance syndrome

Carbohydrate intolerance comes in many shades and colors, shapes and sizes.

I call all of its varieties the Carbohydrate Intolerance Syndrome, or CIS. (Not to be confused with CSI, or Crime Scene Investigation . . . though, come to think of it, perhaps there are some interesting parallels!)

At its extreme, it is called type II diabetes, in which any carbohydrate generates an extravant increase in blood sugar, followed by the domino effect of increased triglycerides, reduction in HDL, creation of small LDL, heightened inflammation, etc. and eventually to kidney disease, coronary atherosclerosis, neuropathies, etc.

An intermediate form of carbohydrate intolerance is called metabolic syndrome, or pre-diabetes. These people, for the most part, look and act like diabetics, though their reaction to carbohydrate intake is not as bad. Blood sugar, for instance, might be 125 mg/dl fasting, 160 mg/dl after eating. The semi-arbitrary definition of metabolic syndrome includes at least three of the following: HDL <40 mg/dl in men, <50 mg/dl in women; triglycerides 150 mg/dl or greater; BP 135/80 or greater; waist circumference >40 inches in men, >35 inches in women; fasting glucose >100 mg/dl.

This is where the conventional definitions stop: Either you are diabetic or have metabolic syndrome, or you have nothing at all.

Unfortunately, this means that the millions of people with patterns not severe enough to match the standard definition of metabolic syndrome are often neglected.

How about Kevin?

Kevin, a 56 year old financial planner, is 5 ft 7 inches, 180 lbs (BMI 28.2). His basic measures:

HDL 36 mg/dl
Triglycerides 333 mg/dl

BP 132/78
Waist circumference 34 inches
Blood sugar 98 mg/dl

Kevin meets the criteria for metabolic syndrome on only two of the five criteria and therefore does not "qualify" for the diagnosis.

Kevin's basic lipids showed LDL 170 mg/dl, HDL 36 mg/dl, triglycerides 333 mg/dl.

But take a look at his underlying lipoprotein patterns (NMR):

LDL particle number 2231 nmol/L (equivalent to a "true" LDL of 223 mg/dl)
Small LDL 1811 nmol/l
Large HDL 0.0 mg/dl


In other words, small LDL constitutes 81% of all LDL particles (1811/2231), a severe pattern. Large HDL is the healthy, protective fraction and Kevin has none. These are high-risk patterns for heart disease. These, too, are patterns of carbohydrate intolerance.

Foods that trigger small LDL and reduction in healthy, large HDL include sugars, wheat, and cornstarch. Kevin is carbohydrate-intolerant, although he lacks the (fasting) blood sugar aspect of carbohydrate intolerance. But he shows all the underlying lipoprotein and other metabolic phenomena associated with carbohydrate intolerance.

We could also cast all three conditions under the umbrella of "insulin resistance." But I prefer Carbohydrate Intolerance Syndrome, or CIS, since it immediately suggests the basic underlying cause: eating carbohydrates, especially those that trigger rapid and substantial surges in blood sugar.

CIS is the Disease of the Century, judging by the figures (both numbers and humans) we are seeing. It will dominate healthcare in its various forms for many years to come.

The first treatment for the Carbohydrate Intolerance Syndrome? Some would say the TZD class of drugs like Avandia. Others would say a DASH or TLC (American Heart Association) diet. How about liposuction, twice-daily Byetta injections, or even the emerging class of drugs to manipulate leptin and adiponectin? How do "heart healthy" foods like Cheerios and Cocoa Puffs fit into this? (Don't believe me? The American Heart Association says they're heart healthy!)

The first treatment for the Carbohydrate Intolerance Syndrome is elimination of carbohydrates, except those that come from raw nuts and seeds, vegetables, occasional real fruit (not those green fake grapes), wine, and dark chocolates.

Comments (28) -

  • Sarah

    1/28/2009 2:45:00 PM |

    What's a "fake grape"?

  • Anonymous

    1/28/2009 4:19:00 PM |

    Do you think instant oats, or rolled oats, are ok?

    How about grits?  

    A Southerner trying to find something to replace cheerios or bagel for breakfast!  Already gave up eggs and bacon!

  • Anonymous

    1/28/2009 6:19:00 PM |

    "green fake grapes"
    - can you expand on this or provide a link to another blog entry that explains what is wrong with these? Thanks.

  • Diana Hsieh

    1/29/2009 1:09:00 AM |

    Anonymous -- Why give up eggs and bacon?  Reducing carbs requires increasing fat intake -- and contrary to the conventional wisdom, that's a good thing for your health.  (See Gary Taubes' _Good Calories, Bad Calories_.)

  • Anonymous

    1/29/2009 1:43:00 AM |

    Green grapes:  negligible amounts of reversatol.

    AJL

  • Anonymous

    1/29/2009 2:30:00 AM |

    Yes, I'd like to know if carbs like whole, cooked oat groats and/or wild rice are okay on TYP?  These are the only grains my cardiologist allows on his program.

    Also, what about oat bran, both cooked and uncooked?

    And lastly, ground flax seed?

    madcook

  • Anne

    1/29/2009 3:06:00 AM |

    Anonymous ~ bring back the eggs. add some veges and cheese and that makes a great breakfast. When I eat bacon I buy the stuff without the nitrites. My breakfast often looks like my dinner - lots of low carb veges and protein.

    I am a Southerner and grits are too high carb for me - shoots my blood sugar up to 200. Yup, I have CIS or maybe it is T2DM. Whatever I have, keeping my carbs low seems to be working well.

  • Anonymous

    1/29/2009 4:05:00 AM |

    what's a fake grape?

  • Anna

    1/29/2009 7:59:00 AM |

    Salmon is great for breakfast, either leftover from dinner or cured salmon (gravlax).  So is a salami and cheese plate now and then, for variety.  Breakfast doesn't have to be sweet or  grainy, if one can get out of that mindset.  

    Avocado omelet, sausage (make 2-3 days worth at one time and reheat), baked custard, smoothies.  There are all sorts of great non-grain breakfasts.

  • Grapes of wrath

    1/29/2009 12:22:00 PM |

    Can't say I have heard of fake grapes, well maybe the plastic ones.

  • keith

    1/29/2009 1:17:00 PM |

    fake grapes are seedless green grapes that are effectively candy. fruit with seeds that are close to the way they occurred in nature before we mass produced them are healthier.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/29/2009 2:19:00 PM |

    Madcook--

    All are fine, with little rise in blood sugar except for the oat products, which can raise blood sugar in very carb-sensitive people.

    Ground flaxseed is the very best, with pure protein, oils (including linolenic acid), and fiber but with no digestible starches.

  • Anonymous

    1/29/2009 3:37:00 PM |

    This blog is great, that's why I added it to my top ten health blogs. www.mydailywellnesstip.com

    Jean-Luc Boissonneault

  • Frederick

    1/29/2009 7:01:00 PM |

    Dr. Davis,

    I recently received some curious results on my blood panels and am curious for your feedback. I am sorry to trouble you with my personal story but am not sure where else to go for info. I appreciate any help you can provide, in addition to what you have already done with this blog, which is a terrific resource.

    In May 2007 my blood panel looked like this:

    Total cholesterol 155
    Trigylcerides 65
    HDL 50
    LDL (calc) 92

    In Jan 2009 I received the following:

    Total cholesterol 311!
    Trigylcerides 43
    HDL 88
    LDL (calc) 214!

    I am currently 41, athletic, do high intensity short duration exercise 3-4 times/wk, low body fat, fairly good health. I changed my diet in Jan 2008 from a standard "healthy" diet to paleo style after reading Cordain's book. I followed Cordain's recommendations fairly closely for about six months, eating lots of fruits and veggies, lean meat (trimming the fat), very few starches, and nuts seeds avocados, olive oil, etc. In summer I began reading some blogs and books which recommended a diet higher in sat fats, lower in protein and lower in PUFAs, so I made some changes by severely limiting PUFAs (no more nuts, less fatty chicken and pork) and eating fattier red meat, coconut oil. I also cut down on veggies and fruits and added starches and white rice.

    While I would consider myself a little skeptical about the meaning of cholesterol tests, I am by no means an expert and was amazed by the increase in cholesterol and am very curious what this means and why. I understand that some of the numbers here (e.g. total cholesterol) don't mean much, that some of the numbers (e.g. hdl/tris ratio) are good, that LDL calc is often inaccurate, and that based on my low tris, my LDL is likely to be large and fluffy instead of small and dense. But I am still amazed by the rise and curious what it means. Should I be concerned? Why did this happen so fast? Thanks again for any guidance you can provide.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/29/2009 10:33:00 PM |

    Frederick--

    While I don't make a habit out of responding to personal questions (because they would overwhelm time demands), your changes are quite profound.

    However, there are a number of underlying processes that could account for such a change. One solution would be to obtain lipoprotein analysis to see what the true, underlying patterns are, e.g., what is measured LDL?

    Also, consider thyroid issues.

    Also consider consulting the Track Your Plaque program, in which these discussions are conducted in detail every day.

  • Anna

    1/29/2009 11:13:00 PM |

    Frederick,

    While my numbers are not exactly the same as yours (past and present), they show a similar trend since I have adopted a more paleo-oriented diet, starting about 5 years ago.  The main difference is that I am female, 47 yo (not menopausal yet, and I wouldn't call myself athletic.  I really haven't been worried about the lab numbers, though they raise my endocrinologists eyebrows.  I had my first coronary calcium scan in Dec '08 and my score was 0, no evidence of coronary artery plaque.

    Have you had a coronary calcium scan yet?  That should tell you if your coronary arteries are building plaque or not.  And of course, the detailed analysis of your lipoproteins needs to be done, too, as Dr.Davis mentioned.  

    Keep in mind, the vast majority of the studies and references for  "good" or "bad" lab results in "Westernized" people come from people who *don't* eat paleo.  So there really isn't much of a comparison data base for those Westerners who eat paleo.  Peter at Hyperlipid blog has some discussion of this "lack of comparison data issue".

  • Anonymous

    1/30/2009 4:49:00 AM |

    Frederick,

    Please join us over on the Track Your Plaque membership website.  We routinely discuss issues such as yours, there is a wealth of information there beyond Dr. Davis' book, and we are a friendly, supportive, and well informed group.

    That aside, it appears you have gotten standard blood testing.  Please get an NMR lipoprofile, Berkeley or VAP test done... you will learn so much more.

    You were eating Paleo, but then you've cut out nuts and I see this little kicker: " I also cut down on veggies and fruits and added starches and white rice."  Hummmm... that is definitely not Paleo anymore, and if you are indeed carb sensitive, those additions could completely tip the cart and put you where you appear to be now.

    And I see that Dr. Davis has mentioned thyroid issues... get your doctor to test for those.  You are now "of an age" where these issues begin to express themselves.

    If you have not had one, go get a heart scan.  You will then know where you stand with regard to plaque formation.  BTW, I am talking about a simple heart scan, not the whiz bang 64-slice thing with the big dose of radiation.  Knowledge is power in this regard.

    I have no affiliation with Dr. Davis nor Track Your Plaque, other than as a very satisfied member/subscriber for the past several years.  I would feel alone and bewildered by such issues, were it not for TYP, which is IMO the most cutting edge program available.

    Good luck to you in finding answers to your personal situation.

    madcook

  • Nameless

    1/30/2009 9:25:00 PM |

    Frederick--

    Your rise in LDL... could it simply because you increased saturated fat intake? Your HDL also increased, which would make sense too. And trigs went down.

    Whether or not this is a good thing, I'm not sure. But increased animal fats usually equals higher LDL, higher HDL, lowered trigs (assuming fats replace carb intake).

    Have you measured your C-reactive protein before and after this diet change? I'm curious if saturated fats cause more inflammation, or less.

  • Dr. B G

    1/31/2009 2:12:00 AM |

    Frederick, Diana Hsieh:

    I don't worry about your LDL -- again it is a faulty inaccurate measure as Dr. D talked about in the 'Tale of Two LDL's post.

    Your TGs are Excellent!!

    Your HDLS totally ROCK and are the envy of anyone who knows anything about heart disease (or cancer).

    If you NMR'd or VAP'd your particles -- you would find that they are ALL Large, nice fluffy PHAT buoyant particles (just like Jimmy Moore's who has a similar diet/lifestyle as you two -- no grains, low carb, mod prot, mod-high fat and exercise).

    Likewise, you'll likely find that your HDL2b which are the regressive particles and necessary for optimal longevity and health will be stunning and awesome.

    Keep up the strong work and let us know if you get a particle count and density evaluated (~$99).

    -G

  • Dr. B G

    1/31/2009 2:12:00 AM |

    Frederick, Diana Hsieh:

    I don't worry about your LDL -- again it is a faulty inaccurate measure as Dr. D talked about in the 'Tale of Two LDL's post.

    Your TGs are Excellent!!

    Your HDLS totally ROCK and are the envy of anyone who knows anything about heart disease (or cancer).

    If you NMR'd or VAP'd your particles -- you would find that they are ALL Large, nice fluffy PHAT buoyant particles (just like Jimmy Moore's who has a similar diet/lifestyle as you two -- no grains, low carb, mod prot, mod-high fat and exercise).

    Likewise, you'll likely find that your HDL2b which are the regressive particles and necessary for optimal longevity and health will be stunning and awesome.

    Keep up the strong work and let us know if you get a particle count and density evaluated (~$99).

    -G

  • Anonymous

    1/31/2009 9:05:00 PM |

    Frederick-

    I think your changes are a simple result of "added starches and white rice".
    As you can see from this post from Dr. Davis just days ago, lipid levels can change dramatically and quickly with the added starches.


    http://heartscanblog.blogspot.com/2009/01/making-sense-out-of-lipid-changes.html

  • Trinkwasser

    2/2/2009 6:57:00 PM |

    Here's a big amen! to this post. My FBG is usually under 90 and never over 100. My GTT came back at 193 so "not diabetic" (I've since managed "truly" diabetic numbers by eating on top of a liver dump, but they are unofficial, measured on my own meter.)

    BMI about 22 so not overweight. Fit and active.

    So the ADA calculator still tells me I am at "low risk of diabetes" and that's what doctors have told me all my life despite the most horrendous lipids, including gallstones in my twenties, rising BP, episodes going back 50 years of what I now know to be reactive hypoglycemia (they knock my A1c right down)including ferocious night sweats in childhood. And of course all the other symptoms of diabetes, nocturia, chronic skin infections etc. all blown off because I didn't show that magic FBG rise.

    Curiously all these "neurotic" "hypochondriac" "anxiety" "depression" "pretending to be ill for sympathy" "personality disorder" symptoms have normalised by doing one thing: eating the exact opposite of the "Heart Healthy" diet - so long as I keep carbs to about 60g with the odd excursion to 100g or so I produce better numbers than a lot of "normies".

    Genealogical research shows the family is riddled with "metabolic syndrome" in non-obese people along with other diabetics who were also skinny Type 2s. I don't know how many other families, let alone individuals, have these obvious but not diagnosed type patterns.

    Or how many of them could be so comparatively easily treated.

    Well OK I cheat a bit, an ARB and a statin helps with the BP and LDL but they might not have been necessary if the thing had been caught earlier, or its comparatively slow progression hadn't been speeded up courtesy of the dietician.

    Yes it doesn't take a CSI to diagnose CIS. Just someone who looks at the Big Picture.

    My worst carbohydrate is wheat, spikes my BG about as bad as sugar, I can manage small quantities in the evening though. Fruit is nearly as bad except for berries.

    I shudder at all that healthy muesli I used to shovel into my face for breakfast and swill down with orange juice. I shudder more when I see the dietician's smile of approval.

    I can handle small quantities of oatcakes at breakfast, I favour high protein moderate fat and especially fish and salad, with other meats as a change. I can do ryebread in small quantities by lunchtime. I'd eat eggs if I could stand the taste.

    Carb input goes up on a slope from 15g at breakfast to 30g and sometimes 50g by evening. Masses of veggies, fish, meat, nuts and cheese and the occasional 85% chocolate make up the rest of my diet (oh and the coffee, and red wine, so not entirely paleo).

    None of this came from Medical Professionals in real life, it all came from the interweb and was run past my BG meter. Maybe by the 22nd century it will be mainstream and the Heart Healthy High Carb Low Fat diet will be consigned to the history books as a failed experiment on an entire population.

  • Dr. William Davis

    2/2/2009 10:38:00 PM |

    Trinkwasser--

    Thanks for sharing your wonderfully insightful experience.

    Do I have your permission to feature your comment as the focus of a blog post?

  • Trinkwasser

    2/6/2009 9:07:00 PM |

    You're more than welcome! I like to get my story out as it is a direct opposite of the standard "you made yourself ill through sloth and gluttony" accusation. Big major thanks must go to my late Aunt who did a lot of the genealogical research which discovered the pattern (she was told at 80 she had the blood pressure of a 30 year old, I was the exact opposite!) and died at 88 of an aneurysm: this despite being slightly overweight. So the genes can be survivable so long as we are careful!

  • Small business web site design

    4/3/2009 12:29:00 PM |

    nice  collection

  • Timothy Murphy, MD

    4/18/2009 4:14:00 PM |

    The amazing story of the ascent of the Keys Hypothesis regarding the connection between dietary fat and heart disease is well documented in "Good Calories, Bad Calories", by Gary Taubes.

    As a pediatrician, I do not often counsel about heart disease. But I do deal with obesity in children, and as I am now in my 50's, I am caring more because of my own health.

    The bottom line is that virtually everything we learned about preventing heart disease in medical school is wrong or untested, and an alternative hypothesis has existed that has been largely untested - yet is simpler (and therefore better).

    The role of glucose and insulin in the evolution of obesity and the development of heart disease is finally becoming clear(er), and with the definition of the Metabolic Syndrome, is becoming more "main stream". But the primary drivers of policy (NIH/NHLBI, FDA and ASDA) will not change their recommendations regarding carbohydrate intake.

    It is time for individuals to take charge of their own diet, and the information I have found here is all to the good. I am glad I found this blog.

    TM, Pittsburgh

  • Kelvin

    9/4/2009 12:45:22 PM |

    I am a classic CSI class and after running 5km for 1 1/2 years my blood stayed CSI classic as well, I didn'y follow a good diet but kept my weight down due to excerise - so then it happened - ventricle fibrulation - down for 6 min not breathing while I was shocked and had CPR - had bypass surgery - 46 yrs - read my story google "A hug for his life savers". Following a low card diet now my email is kwillikj@gmail.com

  • buy jeans

    11/3/2010 2:41:40 PM |

    Foods that trigger small LDL and reduction in healthy, large HDL include sugars, wheat, and cornstarch. Kevin is carbohydrate-intolerant, although he lacks the (fasting) blood sugar aspect of carbohydrate intolerance. But he shows all the underlying lipoprotein and other metabolic phenomena associated with carbohydrate intolerance.

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Texas today, tomorrow . . . the world?

Texas today, tomorrow . . . the world?

Texas state representative, Rene Oliveira, has introduced legislation that mandates heart scans for adults in the state of Texas.

Rep. Oliveira

A press release from the SHAPE Society ( Society for Heart Attack Prevention and Eradication) reads:

Assessment of heart attack risk on the basis of traditional risk factors alone such as high cholesterol and high blood pressure and so forth, while useful, misses many who are at high risk and also incorrectly flags some for high risk who are in fact at very low risk of near term heart attack; on the other hand detection of atherosclerosis by non-invasive imaging, as suggested by the SHAPE group, accurately identifies plaque and improves the ability to identify at-risk individuals who could benefit from aggressive preventive intervention while sparing low-risk subjects from unnecessary aggressive medical therapy," said Dr. P.K. Shah, Director of Cardiology at Cedars Sinai Heart Institute in Los Angeles, a leading member of the SHAPE Task Force who is also an active member of the American Heart Association. "Sadly, these vulnerable patients go undetected until struck by a heart attack, because insurance companies don't cover the newer heart attack screening imaging tests."


Rep. Oliveira, whose coronary disease was first uncovered by a heart scan and prompted a bypass operation, states:

"It is about time that we cover preventive screening for the number one killer in Texas, and take action to reduce healthcare costs through preventive healthcare. Right now, we are extending the lives of those who can afford the procedure while hundreds of thousands of Texans with hidden heart disease go undetected because of antiquated thinking. The time has come for this change."


Is this what we've come to? Since practicing physicians are either so entranced by the drug and procedural solutions to heart disease, do we need to resort to heart scan by legislation?

It does indeed appear that we've come to this point. Should this trend catch on, it will surely mean an upfront increase in healthcare costs to cover the expense of heart scans. But in the long run, it will mean reduction in healthcare costs--dramatic reduction--if heart scans prompt effective preventive action.
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Fasting and heart disease

Fasting and heart disease

Followers of the Track Your Plaque program know that we advocate periodic fasts to reduce heart disease risk.

I came across an interesting report form an abstract presented at last week's American Heart Association meetings in Orlando:

(Read the report at HeartWire. You will need to register or sign-in.)

In this study, the investigators tried to determine why members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (LDS) tended to have reduced risk of heart disease compared to others in the area but not in the LDS faith. While the reduced risk of heart disease in LDS members had been traditionally attributed to the no smoking policy advocated by the Mormon church, the investigators suspected that there was more to the reduced risk.

Of 515 people interviewed, periodic fasting, whether for religious or other reasons, was found to distinguish people who were less likely to have coronary disease by conventional catheterization (59% vs. 67%). (Since the study was published in only abstract form, it's not clear why all these people underwent heart catheterization in the first place.)

Nonetheless, it's an interesting observation and one consistent with the benefits we see when someone fasts: reduced blood pressure, reduced inflammatory responses, improved lipids and lipoproteins, weight loss.

Fasting can be an especially effective method to gain control over heart disease and coronary plaque if rapid control is desired. In fact, I wonder if the normally year-long process of plaque control that I advocate can be much abbreviated. Fasting, I believe, is a crucial component of rapid control, what I've talked about in Instant Heart Disease Reversal

There's also additional thoughts on fasting in my Heart Scan Blog post, For rapid success, try the "fast" track.

Fasting is not something to fear. It can be an enlightening process that can serve to abruptly sever bad habits, perhaps even turn the clock back on prior dietary and lifestyle excesses. My favorite variation on fasting is to use soy milk (yes, yes, I know! I can already hear the the soy bashers screaming!) as a meal substitute. It is an easy, less dramatic way that still maintains most of the benefit of a full, water-only fast.

Comments (10) -

  • Thomas

    11/14/2007 5:20:00 AM |

    I haven't read the article, but I wonder if insulin would be statistically different in a group of periodic fasters than the general pop. I also wonder if running a lower average insulin level makes it relatively easier to fast; those with higher insulin levels might find the food urges too strong to resist, or get other side effects trying to fast.

    Dr. Davis, any thoughts on insulin levels as a reflection of cardiac status, or as a marker of success with dietary changes?

  • Dr. Davis

    11/14/2007 12:54:00 PM |

    I don't know of any direct evidence, but I have seen such phenomena repeatedly in people following heathier diets and exercise programs: a drop in insulin, a drop in blood sugar, parallel with improvements in lipids and lipoproteins.  

    I also don't know if a reduced insulin level per se makes fasting easier, but I do find that people who eat better find it easier. The Twinkies-soda pop set find fasting impossibly difficult and lose interest within a few hours, or simply are terrified of trying due to insatiable hunger.

  • Sue

    11/16/2007 3:30:00 AM |

    Dr Davis,
    Is there another subsitute for soy milk?  Perhaps some kind of protein shake along with the vegie juice will suffice?  Is the fast for 2 days only or can you do it longer?

  • Dr. Davis

    11/16/2007 12:15:00 PM |

    Hi, Sue--

    I fear I've oversimplified just to make a point.

    There are indeed variations of "fasts" such as juice fasts, soy milk fasts, or other severe calorie-restrictions, such as vegetable only diets. Two resources for far more detailed discussion of the how-to's and pitfalls can be found in the www.trackyourplaque.com Special Report, Fasting: Fast Track to Control Plaque, or Dr. Joel Furhman's book, Fasting and Eating for Health.

  • mrfreddy

    11/16/2007 7:18:00 PM |

    I started an intermittent fasting program known as fast-5 (fast-5.com) a couple of months ago. You skip breakfast and lunch-it's tough at first but you really do get used to it-and then have a glorious feast at dinner time. I'm doing it primarily as way to cut down calories while still enjoying great low carb food. The fact that it reduces inflammation, etc. is just a nice bonus!

  • Nancy M.

    11/23/2007 6:09:00 PM |

    Me again, just found this regarding fasting and blood sugar normalization.  I thought you might be interested in it.  It's a fellow with T2 diabetes who lowered his blood sugar with intermittent fasting.

    http://shurie.com/lee/writing_defeat_diabetes.htm

  • Dr. Davis

    11/24/2007 1:07:00 AM |

    Hi, Nancy--

    What an interesting story!

  • blogblog

    10/30/2010 3:44:57 AM |

    Hi. I am trained as food scientist with additional training in exercise physiology. I have decided to go on a 10 day water fast (with vitamins and electrolytes). After 3 days I feel fantastic and am starting to lose the small amount of belly fat. I have absolutely no hunger.

  • blogblog

    10/30/2010 3:47:50 AM |

    It should be remembered that hunter-gathers have highly variable kilojoule intakes varying from periodic gluttony to short periods of near starvation.

  • buy jeans

    11/3/2010 2:32:46 PM |

    Nonetheless, it's an interesting observation and one consistent with the benefits we see when someone fasts: reduced blood pressure, reduced inflammatory responses, improved lipids and lipoproteins, weight loss.

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Don't overdo the vitamin D

Don't overdo the vitamin D

As time passes and I advise more and more people to supplement vitamin D, I gain increasing respect for this powerful "vitamin". I am convinced that vitamin D replacement is the reason for a recent surge in our success rates in dropping CT heart scan scores. I believe it is also explains the larger drops we've been witnessing lately--20-30%.

But vitamin D can be overdone, too. Too much of a good thing . . .

Despite being labeled a "vitamin", cholecalciferol is actually a hormone. Vitamins are obtained from food and you can thereby develop deficiencies because of poor intake. Deficiency of vitamin C, for instance, arises from a lack of vegetables and fruits.

Vitamin D, on the other hand, is nearly absent from food. The only naturally-occuring source is oily fish like salmon and sardines. Milk usually has a little (100 units per 8 oz) because milk producers have been required by law to put it there to reduce the incidence of childhood rickets.

A woman came to me with a heart scan score of nearly 3800, the highest score I've every seen in a woman. (Record for a male >8,000!) She was taking vitamin D by prescription from her family doctor but at a dose of 150,000 units per week, or approximately 21,000 units per day. This had gone on for about 3-4 years. This may explain her excessive coronary calcium score. Interestingly, she had virtually no lipoprotein abnormalities identified, which by itself is curious, since most people have some degree of abnormality like small LDL. Obviously, I asked her to stop the vitamin D.

Should you be afraid of vitamin D? Of course not. If your neighbor is an alcoholic and has advanced cirrhosis, does that mean you shouldn't have a glass or two of Merlot for health and enjoyment? It's a matter of quantity. Too little vitamin D and you encourage coronary plaque growth. Too much vitamin D and you trigger "pathologic calcification", or the deposition of calcium in inappropriate places and sometimes to extreme degrees, as in this unfortunate woman.

Ideally, you should have your doctor check your 25-OH-vitamin D3 blood levels twice a year in summar and in winter. We aim for a level of 50 ng/ml, the level at which the phenemena of deficiency dissipate.

Comments (1) -

  • curious

    11/5/2007 9:06:00 PM |

    Don't forget Vitamine K's role! MK4 should be taken along such high D3 doses. Actually, i recomend some anyway.

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Flush-free niacin kills

Flush-free niacin kills

Here, I re-post a conversation I've posted before, that of the scam product, "no-flush" niacin, also known as "flush-free" niacin.

I find this issue particularly bothersome, since I have a patient or two each and every week who forgets the explicit advice I gave them to avoid these scam products altogether. Despite costing more than conventional niacin, they exert no effect, beneficial or otherwise. Niacin--the real thing--exerts real and substantial beneficial effects. No-flush or flush-free does nothing except drain your wallet. I continue to marvel at the fact that supplement manufacturers persist in selling this product. Ironically, it commands a significant premium over other niacin forms.

They are outright scams that should be avoided altogether.


My former post, No-flush niacin kills:

Gwen was miserable and defeated.

No wonder. After a bypass operation failed just 12 months earlier with closure of 3 out of 4 bypass grafts, she has since undergone 9 heart catheterization procedures and received umpteen stents. She presented to me for an opinion on why she had such aggressive coronary disease (despite Lipitor).

No surprise, several new causes of heart disease were identified, including a very severe small LDL pattern: 100% of LDL particles were small.

Given her stormy procedural history, I urged Gwen to immediately drop all processed carbohydrates from her diet, including any food made from wheat or corn starch. (She and her husband were shocked by this, by the way, since she'd been urged repeatedly to increase her whole grains by the hospital dietitians.) I also urged her to begin to lose the 30 lbs of weight that she'd gained following the hospital dietitians' advice. She also added fish oil at a higher-than-usual dose.

I asked her to add niacin, among our most effective agents for reduction of small LDL particles, not to mention reduction of the likelihood of future cardiovascular events.

Although I instructed Gwen on where and how to obtain niacin, she went to a health food store and bought "no-flush niacin," or inositol hexaniacinate. She was curious why she experienced none of the hot flush I told her about.

When she came back to the office some weeks later to review her treatment program, she told me that chest pains had returned. On questioning her about what she had changed specifically, the problem became clear: She'd been taking no-flush niacin, rather than the Slo-Niacin I had recommended.

What is no-flush niacin? It is inositol hexaniacinate, a molecule that indeed carries six niacin molecules attached to an inositol backbone. Unfortunately, it exerts virtually no effect in humans. It is a scam. Though I love nutritional supplements in general, it pains me to know that supplement distributors and health food stores persist in selling this outright scam product that not only fails to exert any of the benefits of real niacin, it also puts people like Gwen in real danger because of its failure to provide the effects she needed.

So, if niacin saves lives, no-flush niacin in effect could kill you. Avoid this scam like the plague.

No-flush niacin does not work. Period.


Disclosure: I have no financial or other relationship with Upsher Smith, the manufacturer of Slo-Niacin.


Copyright 2008 William Davis, MD

Comments (12) -

  • JPB

    11/29/2008 4:15:00 PM |

    What is your opinion of "Nia-Span"?  My former doctor insisted that this "by prescription only" drug was the only way to take niacin.  The cost per month was virtually the same as for a statin.  (BTW, I declined this product and continued with regular niacin.)

  • Anna

    11/29/2008 4:31:00 PM |

    FYI: the Slo-Niacin link isn't working.

  • Zbig

    11/29/2008 11:02:00 PM |

    RDA for niacin is 18 mg/day - what is your opinion on that, sir?
    BTW, do you guys in the States just go to a pharmacy and buy niacin and D3 without a prescription?

  • Anonymous

    11/30/2008 6:37:00 AM |

    "Slo-Niacin" uses a "polygel" to delay release of the nicotinic acid.  I've been taking Carlson's "Niacin-Time" (also nicotinic acid) which uses brazil wax to delay release.

    The Carlson's product is about a third the price of the Slo-Niacin.

  • IggyDalrymple

    12/1/2008 1:13:00 AM |

    I've been taking regular (not no-flush) niacin for a few months.  Dr Davis recommends "Slo-Niacin" but I got sick from taking timed-release niacin back in the 80s and "Slo-Niacin" sounds suspiciously like "Timed-Release".  I should know in January when I have bloodwork, if the regular niacin helps.

  • Anonymous

    12/3/2008 9:26:00 PM |

    JPB: Niaspan releases over 6-8 hours and yes..it is prescription only. I substituted it for Endur-acin which is MUCH cheaper and non-prescription and also releases over 6-8 hours. No difference in my lipid profiles...just big savings in my pocket book.

    Zbig: 18mg is probably sufficient as a RDA, but in order to achieve the lipid lowering affects from Niacin, one has to take larger doses of 500mg or more from what I understand. And yes, we can buy many supplements like (high dose) niacin, vitamin D3 & even DHEA without a prescription here in the USA.

    Anonymous: I believe Carlson buys their "Niacin-Time" from Endur. I looked at the picture on the Carlson website and the tablets are the exact same shape as Endur-acin. Endur has been around since the late 1980's from what I understand. You can buy direct from Endur.

    IggyDalrmple: Here is a link to an excellent article about (time-release) Niacin written by Doctor Davis himself:

    http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2007/mar2007_atd_01.htm

  • CindynHouston

    2/3/2009 5:15:00 AM |

    Hi, Id like to know what research supports flush free Niacin has no effect on the human body ?
    I had/have horrible heart palpitations after a heart attack, and after taking Flush Free Niacin 2 to 3 times daily, control them, while time released I tried did not .. and Im afraid to take regular Niacin being so unstable.  I take several other things as well now, but not at the beginning.  I have Late Stage Lyme which has its own set of causal factors as well as the typical ones, but if it has no effect on the human body .. it wouldnt work period.  So, I would guess ..  like all else one thing might work for some, another substance for another depending on what I wish they would narrow down to "Cause".  I still have high Blood pressure, some medications work for a week or two, then stop being effective.  Areas of the brain control heart beat .. I have no clue if this is the whats causing high blood pressure or not .. Lyme can go any where and do anything .. Ive had it since I was a child with mild symptoms until my immune system got a faulty in mid thirties when it became aggressive.  No Doctors know how to treat other than antibiotics, dont treat symptoms like really bad hypercoagulation (thick blood) caused by being exposed to bacteria etc for a long period of time and the immune system becoming over active .. 2002 I had an attack which took me out almost completely .. No heart or other doctor even tried to diagnose and gave me a "hearts fine" .. 3 yrs later I had an almost deadly heart attack.  All these yrs, almost 10 .. spent trying to find help, treating symptoms on my own, having no family and absolutely No life, except for trying to survive. (people with Lyme ramble) Though its good to know info.... Question still remains about Flush Free Niacin...

  • Anonymous

    8/25/2009 9:29:49 PM |

    "IHN is more effective than niacin in its hypocholesterolemic,
    antihypertensive and lipotropic effects"
    Welsh AL, Eade M. Inositol hexanicotinate for improved nicotinic acid therapy.
    Int Record Med 1961;174:9-15.

    "significant lipid-lowering effects of IHN at doses of 400 mg 3-4 times daily"
    Dorner V, Fischer FW. The influence of m-inositol hexanicotinate ester on the serum lipids and lipoproteins. Arzneim-Forsch 1961;11:110-113.

    Sommer H. Nicotinic acid levels in the blood and fibrinolysis under the influence of the hexanicotinic ester of m-inositol. Arzneim Forsch. 1975;15:1337

    "IHN was found to be more effective than niacin in reducing hypercholesterolemia"
    El-Enein AMA, Hafez YS, Salem H, Abdel M. The role of nicotinic acid and inositol hexaniacinate as anticholesterolemic and antilipemic agents.
    Nutr Reports Int 1983;28:899-911.

    "Derivatives of niacin have been examined for their ability to alter lipid levels as well as niacin. It would be advantageous if the niacin vasodilation (flush) were eliminated or removed. The main disadvantage of the niacin derivatives will be cost. Inositol hexanicotinate is an ester of inositol and niacin. In the body it is slowly hydrolyzed releasing both of these important nutrients. The ester is more effective than niacin in lowering cholesterol and triglyceride levels, Abou El-Enein, Hafez, Salem and Abdel (1983). I have used this compound, Linodil, available in Canada but not the U.S.A. (at the time this paper was written) for thirty years for patients who can not or will not tolerate the flush. It is very gentle, effective, and can be tolerated by almost every person who uses it."
    From: Niacin, Coronary Disease and Longevity by Abram Hoffer, M.D., Ph.D.

  • LynP

    11/16/2009 5:25:16 AM |

    Question:  at dinner took 500 mgm Slo-Niacin and within a few hrs had some stomach unpleasant...sensations might be the best description, then my glucose rose.  Fasting rose 25 pts (shock) and yesterday was marked with ravenous hunger and 15-20 pts higher glucose all day; today's fasting was still higher than usual.  Is this expected?  It's almost as if it is undoing the work of my 1500 mg metformin ER in reducing the production of sugar in the liver. This isn't going to wk with higher glucose.  Suggestions? Comments?
    6/25/09 labs: TRI-119, calc LDL-150, HDL-57, D-35, TSH-4.5, AIC-6.4. Taking 12.5 mg Maxzide, 4K IU D3.
    9/22/09 labs: TRI-145, calc LDL-147, HDL-60, D-41, TSH-5.5, AIC-6.5, ApoB-111. Taking 12.5 mg Maxzide, 8K IU D3.
    Doc put me on 25 mcg levothyroxine (don't think this is enough or I need Armour).

    I think my TRI is up from too much carb (eat super low, ate a bit more more berries over summer).  I think my LDL is up from my rising TSH (free T4 & T3 midrange), been rising since Sept08 when it was 2.8 (when I started taking vit D). Wt loss (obese) has been stalled until I started subbing eggs for hi-protein shake with 2-3 ozs coconut milk a month ago.  TSH was high in 2001 (4.7) with high amts of reverse T3 (doc won't test for it)& given 2 mcg Cytomel but my TC was 205 with TRI=100. Now what to do?  Try the 250 mgm SloNiacin & see what happens?  Or just concentrate on improving D levels and improving thyroid function and hoping they help normalize lipids? Just looking for suggestions, not treatment, all ideas will be run by doc. He said statins or niacin...I'm female no familiy hist of heart probs, why statins with no good studies for women? 'Cause he takes a statin *sigh*.

  • Anonymous

    8/16/2010 3:17:08 AM |

    After my heart attack from Late Stage Lyme Disease causing hypercoagulation/thick blood .. after released from the hospital, I had/have severe heart palpatations .. and IM SORRY BUT, FLUSH FREE NIACIN DOES WORK!!  I have to take 2-500mg twice daily and it stops the heart palpatations .. its no gimmick or hype.  IT Works !!  Ive heard about the severe very uncomfortable flush rush with regular Niacin which I think would scare me and make me panick, if not make me ill with the fragile state my system is in.  Purchased at any store online or otherwise .. a lot less than and w/no side effects, I also take Argnine to help open my vessels, but is not needed to stop my heart palpatations. Obviously, something is wrong though if I or anyone is having heart palpatation, so you should keep looking or asking RN/head nurse until you find a heart doctor who will actually address the issue and find out whats going on!!  Once in a while with stressful event I do need to take a beta blocker to stop palpations, but only 3-5 times a yr.  NO SIDE EFFECTS like beta blockers...

  • buy jeans

    11/3/2010 3:18:31 PM |

    Given her stormy procedural history, I urged Gwen to immediately drop all processed carbohydrates from her diet, including any food made from wheat or corn starch. (She and her husband were shocked by this, by the way, since she'd been urged repeatedly to increase her whole grains by the hospital dietitians.) I also urged her to begin to lose the 30 lbs of weight that she'd gained following the hospital dietitians' advice. She also added fish oil at a higher-than-usual dose.

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Normal fasting glucose with high HbA1c

Normal fasting glucose with high HbA1c

Jonathan's fasting glucose: 85 mg/dl
His HbA1c: 6.7%

Jonathan's high HbA1c reflects blood glucose fluctuations over the preceding 60-90 days and can be used to calculate an estimated average glucose (eAG) with the following equation:

eAG = 28.7 X A1c – 46.7

(For glucose in mmol/L, the equation is eAG = 1.59 × A1C - 2.59)

Jonathan's HbA1c therefore equates to an eAG of 145.59 mg/dl--yet his fasting glucose value is 85 mg/dl. 

This is a common situation: Normal fasting glucose, high HbA1c. It comes from high postprandial glucose values, high values after meals. 

It suggests that, despite having normal glucose while fasting, Jonathan experiences high postprandial glucose values after many or most of his meals. After a breakfast of oatmeal, for instance, he likely has a blood glucose of 150 mg/dl or greater. After breakfast cereal, blood glucose likely exceeds 180 mg/dl. With two slices of whole wheat bread, glucose likewise likely runs 150-180 mg/dl. 

The best measure of all is a postprandial glucose one hour after the completion of a meal, a measure you can easily obtain yourself with a home glucose meter. Second best: fasting glucose with HbA1c.

Gain control over this phenomenon and you 1) reduce fasting blood sugar, 2) reduce expression of small LDL particles, and 3) lose weight.  

Comments (24) -

  • Mark

    3/23/2010 5:56:04 PM |

    So what is the basic recommendation here?
    Eat meat, nuts, vegetables, no starch, no fruit? A ketogenic diet?

    It looks like the recommendation is to avoid blood sugar spikes primarily. I would think that insulin is less of a worry because insulin doesn't necessarily mean that sugar is in the system (dairy for example).

    Some clarification would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

  • Anonymous

    3/23/2010 6:44:31 PM |

    Dr. Davis, my husband has the opposite problem, can you (or anyone else) explain it?  His 1-hour postprandial glucose never exceeds 90 and yet he has an HBA1C of 5.9.  We have checked his glucose at different times and it never goes over 100.  He is on a very low carb diet.  

    His HBA1C indicates an average blood glucose of 123, but we never see readings this high.  Is there something else that can glycating hemoglobin and thus show an elevated HBA1C reading?

  • Anonymous

    3/23/2010 7:03:19 PM |

    What would be considered an optimal (or at least good) HbA1c level? And same for fasting glucose?

    I have noticed my fasting glucose tends to vary, between 80-95, with my HbA1c at 4.6.

    Curious also if there is any data on HbA1c correlating directly with triglyceride levels.

    My own trig values are higher than I like, around 125-150, yet I limit carbs, use fish oil, and think my HbA1c number is relatively decent.  So wondering if carbs/glucose isn't my problem, what else raises triglycerides?

  • Jake P.

    3/23/2010 10:30:18 PM |

    Dr Davis, do you have any recommendations on blood glucose test meters, as far as brand/model? Also, I'd prefer something that doesn't require a prescription, if possible.

  • Dr. William Davis

    3/24/2010 1:41:43 AM |

    Anon--

    The only two causes I am aware of are 1) iron deficiency anemia, and 2) hemoglobin variants.

    Also, are you confident of the accuracy of your blood glucose meter? You can check it by running side-by-side glucoses with a blood draw.

  • Dr. William Davis

    3/24/2010 1:42:31 AM |

    I've had good experiences with One Touch Ultramini, Aviva, Relion, and Accuchek meters. All are available without prescription.

  • Anonymous

    3/24/2010 5:26:17 AM |

    This is exactly why everybody should have a blood glucose meter, and know their numbers.

    While I have not been diagnosed as having type 2 diabetes, I was darned close.  My meter, and the information found here and in the blogs that link to and from it, have helped me to lose about 3 pounds per week for the past 6 months, and not be hungry or feel deprived.

    I was like Jonathan.  Until 6 months ago my fasting glucose was always under 100.  Now that I am managing to keep my average BG reading, including post prandial readings, under 95, I have stopped suffering from the inflammatory symptoms I've had for a decade.

    My meter and initial 100 test strips was the best under $50 purchase I've ever made.

    Thanks for the USEFUL information I get at The Heart Scan Blog.

  • Alfredo E.

    3/24/2010 2:52:07 PM |

    Hi All. I eat a low carbs diet and I have the a high fasting glucose, 95-105, but a low postprandial, 85-100.

    I also exercise everyday and do Intermittent Fasting.

    What could be the mechanism working here?

    Thanks for your ideas.

    Alfredo E.

  • Anonymous

    3/24/2010 3:20:00 PM |

    David Mendosa has a good blog/site/comments... on diabeties for many things A1C, food, low carb, etc. Check him out at www.mendosa.com
    Look under "health central" or

    http://www.healthcentral.com/diabetes/c/17/75106/david-guide-a1c-6-0

    For A1C guidance.

    He seems to lean away from strict AHA, ADA, and government things that do not work for him.

    His meter data is getting a little dated, and he does not specify exact things like he states vitamin D, as opposed to stating: D3. And he seems to be a little soft about major statements, possible law suit shy.

  • Anonymous

    3/24/2010 4:01:15 PM |

    I'm curious why you believe that gaining control over postprandial glucose will result in lower *fasting* glucose.  Is there a mechanism for this?  I've found that my fasting glucose hasn't fallen since I started the TYP diet 3 months ago; it's still in the mid to high 90s -- even though my one hour glucose is rarely much higher than that.

  • Anonymous

    3/24/2010 6:40:34 PM |

    Responding to Dr. Davis' comment:
    "The only two causes I am aware of are 1) iron deficiency anemia, and 2) hemoglobin variants.

    Also, are you confident of the accuracy of your blood glucose meter? You can check it by running side-by-side glucoses with a blood draw."

    I don't think he has iron deficiency anemia unless high ferritin level indicates that?  His ferritin level was 320 at the time he got the HBA1C of 5.9.  What are hemoglobin variants?

    We have the Accuchek meter and have also had fasting and post-prandial lab tests done and the meter seems to be in the ballpark.

    Thank you very much for your reply.

  • Anne

    3/24/2010 9:28:20 PM |

    My fasting was below 100. My A1C was 6.5. A OGTT spiked at 202. My doctors told me as long as my fasting BG was good, I did not have to worry as I only had insulin resistance not diabetes. That was 10 yrs ago.

    A year ago I bought a glucometer and started eliminating foods that spike my BG. My last A1C was 5.5.

    I wish I could get a hold of the results of my OGTT from 40 yrs ago. I was told it was slightly abnormal but I did not have diabetes. How much damage has been done from elevated postprandial blood sugars?

  • Anonymous

    3/25/2010 12:20:28 AM |

    Dr. Davis,

    Would you anticipate that a healthy 25 year old would obtains similarly high postprandial sugars to those meals?  Or do young, healthly, slim people have high glucose tolerance, and hence low postprandial responses to sugar?  I've seen many articles featuring sports stars who subsist on high carb, low fat diets, such as rafael nadal, roger federer, tiger woods... I find it hard to believe they exceed 120 mg/dl postprandially...

    David

  • mikyy748

    3/27/2010 5:31:11 AM |

    Please help with an explanation ! My last meal of the day (with NO carbs) is around 4PM. At 9-10PM, my glucose test shows about 100-105. But... in the morning the test shows 125-130. How is it possible?!

  • Anonymous

    4/10/2010 4:37:12 AM |

    Veeerrrrry interesting!

    I have been on an extremely resrricted carb diet for several months.  My One Touch (and my wife's, she's T1 on a pump) my glucose levels never vary from 100-120 with the vast majority right around 110-113. Tests are run about once a day at various times including 1-2 hours post prandial.

    At my PCP's office (she's also an endocrinologist) today, her office machine complained of an HbA1C of 20+ and wouldn't give a reading, while it did report my other lipid levels, most moderately elevated as usual.

    Tubes were drawn for processing by a lab.  Of course it's the weekend and I'm obsessing about it... sigh.
    I worry that my low carb lifestyle might be masking what would be high glucose readings which is not very logical, or if something is wrong with my blood such as anemia.  A quick google and here I am.

    I wonder if this is common for extremely low-carber diabetics?

    Am on low doses of Diovan, HCTZ and colchicine...

    Thanks to all for any thoughts.
    -Ron

  • Anonymous

    4/13/2010 2:26:58 PM |

    Thanks to all who commented ;)

    Lab work came back with an HbA1C of 5.9, so the office machine was just being stupid as hoped/mostly expected.

    Good luck to everyone else.

  • mongander

    4/27/2010 11:22:25 PM |

    This MedScape article doesn't make sense.  It claims that <6 may be too low...That >7 has a better all cause mortality.
    http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/720391

  • William A. Ryan

    7/15/2010 1:32:59 PM |

    FYI, another possible cause of abnormally high HbA1c is Vitamin B12 and/or folate deficiency.  This causes anemia with low red blood cell turnover, so any given Hb molecule is floating around longer, and thus has a higher probability of glycation.

  • Helena

    9/29/2010 11:01:56 PM |

    So.. I just started testing my blood sugar again today... first reading was 90
    Then I had lunch. Rice and curry with coconut milk (probably loaded with sugar) and it went from 156 to 258 to 124 in 2.5 hours after that meal... I am a little concerned.

    Think I will go back on my low carb diet ASAP!

  • Helena

    9/30/2010 3:22:01 PM |

    Let me correct my numbers... I didn't have them in front of me when I wrote the previous post so here they are:

    Lunch was Rice, shrimp, coconut milk based curry pot

    Blood levels:
    60 min after - 193
    90 min after - 217
    130 min after - 258
    2.5 hrs after - 140

    This morning I had a reading of 89 and after having my protein shake with cream and water it was 106...

    Def going to go back to my low carb diet asap!
    Thanks for a great blog full of valuable information and help to get back on track.

  • Anonymous

    10/15/2010 2:05:41 PM |

    This is a recent day of testing. 90 minutes after eating 50 grams of processed brown flax, my BG was about 117, but it also depends on what I eat the night before. 2 hrs after eating 8 oz hummus with tahini, my BG was 101. 1 hr after eating a 143 gram (quick rolled) oat cake with 95 grams chocolate syrup with a lot of sugar and water, my BG was 120. Next day fasting BG was 120. Carbs do a good job of BG stabilization, although I'm trying to decrease some carbs and lower my fasting BG. I will try soymilk, and less carbs.

  • H Saleem

    11/22/2010 9:04:14 PM |

    Hi, Let me add my 2Cs. The objectives for diabetics and pre-diabetics are poles apart and confusing the two can  lead to irreparable loss for the pre-diabetics and those with insulin resistance.  

    For diabetics, when the disease is well established, the focus is on minimizing the harm i.e. to minimize the blood sugar level. Elevated blood sugar does so much harm in the long run that it should be kept under control through any means possible: diet, exercise, medicine, weight loss etc. When one plan and/or drug regimen fails to control the blood glucose level, it is replaced by another, all the time focusing on maintaining optimum blood glucose levels resulting in normal (for diabetics) readings on fasting glucose, HbA1C etc. I am not fully aware but possibly there is no mainstream healthcare regimen or drug that focuses on  reversing the disease or trying to minimize diabetes damages (other than those caused by high blood glucose) like destruction of pancreatic cells.

    For pre-diabetics and those with insulin resistance, the focus should NOT be on lowering blood glucose level DIRECTLY. For pre-diabetes, it is possible to keep on "travelling" towards diabetes in reality but assuming otherwise just because some "local" interference does not let the blood sugar rise. So if you start taking any alpha-glucidase, your postprandial reading will not rise much. But this does not mean that you have controlled pre-diabetes. The causes are all there like being over-weight, lack of exercise bla bla. And your body's normal ability to regulate blood sugar keeps on deteriorating ultimately leading to a point when the alpha-glucidase alone will not be sufficient. So when pre-diabetes is treated like diabetes, it can lead to actual diabetes. This is because here the focus should not be on lowering blood glucose levels or "treating" the condition but REVERSING it. In other words the goal should be to transform the body back to the point where it can naturally process the foods while keeping the blood glucose levels and HbA1C levels in normal range. All this without the help of any drugs or special diet or aids. And for this the usual solutions are already well known: weight-loss, exercise etc.

    The moral of the story is that if you are pre-diabetic, you can keep yourself happy by eating almonds, vinegar or psyllium with meals to "show" you that your post-prandial glucose levels are in range. This can be done by eating a low-carn diet or taking diabetes drugs. But if keep the same weight, continue the same eating habbits, and do no exercise then you are possibly doing nothing to prevent a preventable disease.

  • H Saleem

    11/22/2010 9:04:58 PM |

    Hi, Let me add my 2Cs. The objectives for diabetics and pre-diabetics are poles apart and confusing the two can  lead to irreparable loss for the pre-diabetics and those with insulin resistance.  

    For diabetics, when the disease is well established, the focus is on minimizing the harm i.e. to minimize the blood sugar level. Elevated blood sugar does so much harm in the long run that it should be kept under control through any means possible: diet, exercise, medicine, weight loss etc. When one plan and/or drug regimen fails to control the blood glucose level, it is replaced by another, all the time focusing on maintaining optimum blood glucose levels resulting in normal (for diabetics) readings on fasting glucose, HbA1C etc. I am not fully aware but possibly there is no mainstream healthcare regimen or drug that focuses on  reversing the disease or trying to minimize diabetes damages (other than those caused by high blood glucose) like destruction of pancreatic cells.

    For pre-diabetics and those with insulin resistance, the focus should NOT be on lowering blood glucose level DIRECTLY. For pre-diabetes, it is possible to keep on "travelling" towards diabetes in reality but assuming otherwise just because some "local" interference does not let the blood sugar rise. So if you start taking any alpha-glucidase, your postprandial reading will not rise much. But this does not mean that you have controlled pre-diabetes. The causes are all there like being over-weight, lack of exercise bla bla. And your body's normal ability to regulate blood sugar keeps on deteriorating ultimately leading to a point when the alpha-glucidase alone will not be sufficient. So when pre-diabetes is treated like diabetes, it can lead to actual diabetes. This is because here the focus should not be on lowering blood glucose levels or "treating" the condition but REVERSING it. In other words the goal should be to transform the body back to the point where it can naturally process the foods while keeping the blood glucose levels and HbA1C levels in normal range. All this without the help of any drugs or special diet or aids. And for this the usual solutions are already well known: weight-loss, exercise etc.

    The moral of the story is that if you are pre-diabetic, you can keep yourself happy by eating almonds, vinegar or psyllium with meals to "show" you that your post-prandial glucose levels are in range. This can be done by eating a low-carn diet or taking diabetes drugs. But if keep the same weight, continue the same eating habbits, and do no exercise then you are possibly doing nothing to prevent a preventable disease.

  • KDL

    12/12/2010 9:50:40 PM |

    I have a 16 year old daughter who HBA1c is 11.7 (yes very high).  I have been working with her especialist to bring it down.  The problem is her daily readings are normal for a type 1 diabetic. I know the monitors can be cheated however I am pretty confident that most of the time she does the right thing.  I also know that sometimes she does not.  However I am wondering if there are any other things that can cause this annomoly?

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Low-carb is heart healthy

Low-carb is heart healthy

Anybody following the discussions in these pages know that: Limiting carbohydrate intake reduces risk for coronary heart disease and heart attack.

First of all, why do conventional diets advocate restricting saturated and total fat? From the standpoint of surrogate markers of cardiovascular risk, cutting saturated and total fat reduces total cholesterol; reduces calculated LDL cholesterol; and may reduce c-reactive protein modestly (an index of inflammation). It also increases blood sugar and HbA1c (reflecting the prior 60 days blood sugars), increases glycation of the proteins of the body leading to cataracts, arthritis, and hypertension.

Problem: Total cholesterol is a combination of HDL cholesterol, an estimate of VLDL cholesterol (triglycerides), and LDL cholesterol. It is a composite of both "good" things (HDL) and "bad" things (LDL and VLDL). Cutting saturated and total fat results in reduced HDL, increased VLDL/triglycerides, and a reduction in calculated LDL. Pretty weak stuff. The last item, i.e., reduction in calculated LDL, is not even a real phenomenon. In fact, the net effect in most genotypes (genetic types) may be negative: increased heart disease risk.

In contrast, what is the effect of reducing carbohydrate without restricting fat? (In the approach I use, we start with elimination of the most destructive of carbohydrates, wheat, followed by reducing exposure to other carbohydrates, especially cornstarch and corn products, sugar, and oats.) If, say, we cut carbohydrate intake into the range of a truly low-carbohydrate diet of 10-15 grams per meal ("net" carbs, or total carbohydrates minus fiber), then we witness a number of metabolic transformations:

Reduced fasting triglycerides and VLDL
Reduced postprandial (after-eating) triglycerides, chylomicrons, and chylomicron remnants
Increased HDL and shift towards large HDL particles (presumably more protective)
Reduced small LDL particles
Reduced glycation and oxidation of small LDL particles
Reduced hemoglobin A1c
Reduced c-reactive protein and other inflammatory markers
Reduced blood pressure

By slashing carbohydrates, we also witness weight loss from visceral fat, reversal of pre-diabetes and diabetes, and reduced phenomena of glycation. And, if the wheat-free part of low-carb is maintained, you can also see marked improvement in gastrointestinal health, relief from joint pains, relief from leg edema, relief from migraine headaches, improved behavior and ability to concentrate in children with impaired learning, ADHD, and autism, better mood, deeper sleep. You will see multiple inflammatory and autoimmune diseases improve or completely relieved, such as rheumatoid arthritis and ulcerative colitis.

Having personally gone down the diabetic path and back by cutting the fat in my diet, now maintaining a HbA1c of 4.8% with fasting glucose 84 mg/d; (without medications), there should be no remaining doubt: Low-carb diets, especially if wheat-free, dramatically reduce the factors leading to heart disease; low-fat diets worsen the factors leading to heart disease.

Comments (88) -

  • Henk Poley

    1/4/2012 6:58:20 AM |

    You'd say with all these claims it should be doable to prove or disprove scientifically. Why is there so much controversy around food?

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/4/2012 7:20:41 AM |

    Hi Dr. Davis,
          I want to thank you for educating me about lipid profiles and think the following data might show readers  how some of your ideas play out (all varied experimentation coincided with a daily high protein intake).

    Innocent  Jan. 2011 1st ever NMR lipo-protein analysis was done after  4 months of  consistent home food prep of pretty low fat (only olive oil  and 1 tablespoon coconut oil daily) but plenty of whole wheat and  half  potatoes:
    * LDL # of particles (P) = 1,676 in nmol/L------------being a LDL cholesterol (C) reading of 139 mg/dL
    * small LDL  # P           = 1,021 nmol/L   ---------------yikes! you advise smLDL be less than 117 nmol/L
    * HDL # of particles      =      28.8 umol/L --------------being a HDL C reading of 45 mg/dL
    * Triglycerides               =      90 mg/dL     -------------- true,  I never struggled with my weight

    (B) May 2011 2nd NMR after another 4 months but added in more fat (1 teaspoon highly concentrated fish oil daily, 90% chocolate, handfulls of nuts, more olive oil and kept coconut oil at 1 tablespoon daily for a controlled experiment), added 500 mg Niacin 3 times a day (in stages up to1,500 mg. total daily), 6000 IU daily vitamin D, deliberately cut out all grains except for social politeness  and substituted in daily Koji fermented brown rice (rustic Amazake):
    ** LDL # P...............=   976 nmol/L -------------------------------- being LDL C of 100 mg/dL
    ** small LDL # P .... =     96 nmol/L -------------------------------- nice surprise
    ** HDL # P ............ =     27.3 umol/L ------------------------------being an increase to  HDL C of 64 mg/dL
    ** Triglycerides ......  =    42 mg/dL -------------------------------- despite daily carbs over 150 gr. daily

    (C) Dec. 2011 3rd NMR after another 7 more months thinking Doc's advice is worthwhile I added in yet more fat (mainly daily 2 tablespoons of coconut oil, more 90% chocolate), bumped Niacin up to 1,000 mg twice a day (2,000 mg. total daily), cut out the Amazake, kept up the vitamin D adding daily vitamin K & daily ate main mid-day meal out as lunch on spicy Thai & Chinese fish/shrimp/soup/rice meals (my next control):
    *** LDL # P .......... = 764 nmol/L ---------------       being LDL C of 107 mg/dL  ( 2x coconut's  saturated fat)
    ***small LDL # P... = less than 90 nmol/L --------surprised me NMR can't count lower
    ***HDL # P .........   =   41.4 umol/L -------------------- being an increase to HDL C of 88 mg/dL
    *** Triglycerides ....=  43 mg/dL -------------------     daily carbs below ~ 120 gr.  &  lost  too much weight

  • Janknitz

    1/4/2012 7:23:37 AM |

    Dr John McDougall is coming out with a new book called "the Starch Solution" which advocates  NO fat and Little protein and eating a minimum of 900 grams of starch each day.  In the 80's he had a local call in talk radio program and I remember callers saying they followed the diet religiously but their triglycerides were sky high. He would tell these callers to stop eating fruit. Not much left when you can't have fat, much protein, or fruit.  He'd also tell callers that giving your child cow's milk guaranteed them to have diabetes and advocated sweetened rice milk instead.

    I'd love to see a well-designed study comparing your approaches.  Just don't ask me to be a test subject for his approach.

  • Stephanie

    1/4/2012 12:38:53 PM |

    I find that I garner all the benefits you list from following this dietary approach with the exception of one -- better sleep.  When I reduce my carbohydrate count, my energy soars and I suffer from terrible insomnia.  I have read that your body adjusts in, but I have not found this to be the case personally.  After 10 days of little sleep, I do notice that my fasting blood sugars are up 10-15 points and concentration starts to suffer (as well as patience).

    Do you have any suggestions for battling low-carb induced insomnia?  If I raise my carbs above 100, my sleep improves, but weight loss ceases (I still have more weight to lose) and blood sugar creeps a little.  I have tried herb teas and melatonin without success.

    Thanks for all you do!

  • Bill

    1/4/2012 1:01:55 PM |

    Dr. Davis, I'm curious what you make of the research showing big inconsistencies in reported LDL particle size between the various advanced lipoprotein analysis techniques. VAP, for example, apparently reports far fewer people as Pattern A than NMR, GGE, or TGE. Even measured LDL-C seems to vary quite a lot between the techniques.

    This seems to call into question the usefulness of such testing, since the results seem to depend mostly on which methodology happens to be chosen. Here's one example that has full text publicly available:

    http://www.clinchem.org/content/52/9/1722.full#_jmp0_

  • JC

    1/4/2012 1:43:55 PM |

    Can you comment on "Forks Over Knives"?

  • Jackie

    1/4/2012 1:46:27 PM |

    Dr. Davis,

    My husband, a patient of yours, has been following the no wheat diet for around 2 months. He also has been limiting his  carbohydrates to around 15 grams per meal.  He runs around 20 miles a week plus bikes around 30 miles a week. He has lost around 20 pounds in the last 2 months. He started at around 160 pounds..... I think he has lost way too much weight for his 6 foot frame. He says, he's just following your guidelines.

    Shouldn't athletes take in more carbohydrates than 15 grams per meal?

    Jackie

  • Todd B

    1/4/2012 2:47:40 PM |

    JC, Dr. Davis can speak for himself; however, if you are looking for a good critique/review of Forks Over Knives, I would recommend this one by Denise Minger:
    http://rawfoodsos.com/2011/09/22/forks-over-knives-is-the-science-legit-a-review-and-critique/

  • Joe

    1/4/2012 4:48:11 PM |

    Jackie, that gives your husband a BMI of 21.9, well within the "normal" range of 18.5 - 24.9.
    Your husband has transformed into a fat burner, and if he's able to continue working out at his current pace, I wouldn't worry about it.  But if he's lost muscle mass, or feels lethargic, he should probably up the carbs a bit, and the protein (perhaps a protein shake, post workouts?).

    A lot of people would love to have your husband's "problem."

  • lconnolly

    1/4/2012 5:18:46 PM |

    Mitochondrial
    Congratulations!
    There are alot of us at Track Your Plaque who are great fans of yours. Wish you would join us.

  • Gene K

    1/4/2012 6:46:19 PM |

    Having taken the same low-carb route and seen all the benefits Dr Davis lists here, I too had good sleep as my remaining frontier. I found the blog of Dr Kruse (http://jackkruse.com) a great addition to Dr Davis's program and a terrific education resource. Please read his sleep-related posts (http://jackkruse.com/category/sleep/) and all the rest for that matter, as all are related. I find it amazing how well these two view points (Dr Davis's and Dr Kruse's) agree. I made these steps to see my sleep improve dramatically: do not eat or exercise after 7:30pm, take a hot shower before bed, go to bed early enough to allow 7.5 hrs to sleep, wear an eye mask during sleep to ensure total darkness, take a capsule of lemon balm herb (Melissa) before bedtime.

  • Jackie

    1/4/2012 8:50:10 PM |

    I get a BMI of 19. On the website that I put in the calculations  it says he is "underweight".

  • Gene K

    1/4/2012 9:28:33 PM |

    And at the same time, the general public can read this: http://www.webmd.com/diet/news/20120104/report-looks-at-best-diets-easiest-to-follow. No comments...

  • Joe

    1/4/2012 10:18:06 PM |

    Jackie, I think I misread your message. I thought he was currently 160 pounds, and apparently he's lost 20 of those pounds, right? If so, this BMI calculator still has him within the "normal" range.

    http://www.cdc.gov/healthyweight/assessing/bmi/

        Underweight = <18.5
        Normal weight = 18.5–24.9
        Overweight = 25–29.9
        Obesity = BMI of 30 or greater

    Anyway, I'd say he's just fine, with the same caveats.  That is, if he's lost muscle mass, eat more protein (especially protein shakes after each workout), and maybe up the carbs a bit if he's feeling weak in any way. I ran the numbers on several other web sites (Mayo Clinic and NIH) and they all say the same. He's within the "normal" range, but just barely.

  • Judy B

    1/4/2012 11:04:28 PM |

    Stephanie,  I found that low carb gave me better sleep except when I took some supplements, etc, at bed time.  Don't know what you are taking, but I found that D3 at night kept me up and recently a new formulation of glucosamine (sp?) did the same (can't figure out what is causing that).  Soo, if you are taking anything in the late afternoon or evening, you might want to experiment and see if taking them earlier helps... Check Seth Roberts for info on D3 scheduling.

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/5/2012 1:16:29 AM |

    Hi Jackie,
    I'm with you on 160 lbs. for 6 footer is too scrawny if the person is healthy . That is also my situation (being  6 feet tall)  if I go  low carb of  (say) fewer than 100 grams carbs daily .There is no current science that  adults being real thin is better than being heavier - just the opposite.
    When I get scrawny there's muscle, but my capacity for day in and day out sustained life style physical exertion is (in my 60 year old body) less than when I weigh more. And a day or two of  missing a good meal & exceptional stress
    or exertion can cause notable dip in weight when I'm eating very low carb.
    Doc has your husband as his  patient,  so there may be other considerations they are considering. I don't wish to confuse BMI with crucial medical goals they are working on. So am speaking of my own monitoring and my lab results (detailed above) are not necessarily what other slim individuals would see.
    I have not tried a months long protracted experiment of  gorging on more dietary fat as an alternative to my eating moderate daily carbs (say,  over 100 grams). Handfuls and handfuls of nuts don't seem to promptly boost me back towards 165 lbs. like augmenting with moderate carbs does.

  • PeggyC

    1/5/2012 4:16:16 AM |

    Stephanie, have you tried Magnesium citrate about an hour before going to bed?  It tends to relax you and help you sleep and it doesn't hurt--Magnesium is one of the one of the things we tend to lose on low carb. I take it to prevent leg cramps and it also helps me get to sleep.

  • PeggyC

    1/5/2012 4:19:59 AM |

    JC, Here is an excellent commentary on Forks over Knives: http://rawfoodsos.com/2011/09/22/forks-over-knives-is-the-science-legit-a-review-and-critique/ I'm sure Dr. Davis will concur with her analysis, though I will let him speak for himself on that.  However, in the mean time, if you haven't checked it out, Denise Minger does a great job of dissecting it.

  • PeggyC

    1/5/2012 6:24:58 AM |

    All I can do is sputter, sputter, sputter.  Talk about ridiculous!  The "diabetes diet" will ensure that a person stays diabetic and dependent on medication.  The "most heart healthy diets" will more than likely cause heart disease rather than prevent it.   The DASH diet also ensures that a person maintains high blood pressure and dependent on medication.  Awful.  But you're right--that's what the general public sees and believes.  Makes me wonder if there is hope.

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/5/2012 8:59:28 AM |

    For Iconnolly & others,
    Doc  has everyone confused why he clinically finds wheat elimination more dramatic on gut fat than just restricting carbs. He decries modern dwarf wheat, yet not all genetic confabulations will have the same lectin protein structure, so this is details how some may play roles in adipose tissue changes. When a lectin has a molecular structure where their folded protein's usual strands coil like a loop, instead of just being strands, then what occupies the loop's center becomes important.

    If the peptide (protein building block) variation has an arginine amino acid leading that lectin's loop it can be a problem. That arginine torques the loop, makes it more flexible overall and gets where it is not supposed to be. It, this type of lectin variation, can itself be used in a pro-inflammatory way. It should be understood this lectin doesn't so much evilly abuse what it touched on the adipose cell as be acting more like a thing (substrate) involved in co-activation.

    Vascular adhesion protein 1 (VAP1) has a lesser known function as an enzyme (VAP1 = semi-carbazide sensitive amine oxidase) and it comes to the surface of adipocytes when there are immunological molecular action. Doc talks about belly fat being prone to inflammatory modulation and obese adipose cells can have macrophages crusting them. (The role of  vascular endothelium VAP1 is not discussed here.)

    On the adipocyte it's VAP1 (a folded glyco-protein molecule) is configured in a way that it's enzymatic function part is down a channel like groove with a leucine amino poking in that pathway sort of  like a goalie. This goalie leucine (Leu469 position) keeps random triggers from getting past it to tag upto where the actual VAP1 activation spot is and provoke stray responses.

    Franken-wheat, as per Doc's opinion,  with an arginine looped lectin can torque/slip past that VAP1 leucine goalie &  get to dock. If the genetic wheat leads with another amino at a lectin loop then it usually (can't say never, since maybe there is a rare amino lectin loop able to dock) basicly won't be able to navigate past the VAP1's  leu469 and engage catalytic action. And, looking at the other end,  there are likely individuals whose VAP1 engender a variation other than leu469 in the goalie placement that actually is less selective and lets some lectins without an arginine led loop slip down the alley to dock  and engage.Thus different world wide batchs of wheat and individual adipose tissue surface responses to lectins in general can vary, as we see.

    Once the franken-lectin with arginine docks into the adipose VAP1's activation center the enzyme  uses that lectin to perform a function. The vulnerable NH2 group of that lectin's arginine amino binds to that VAP1's  molecule called topa-quinone. Then a transitional enzymatic driven state (Schiff base) occurs and, as the Schiff base is not permanent, it segues into a kind of half way oxidation phase (for geeks the VAP1 amine oxidase oxidized the arginine's amine into an aldehyde with a byproduct of hydrogen peroxide, & some ammonium).

    Here, as a consequence of that modified oxidative change over, hydrogen peroxide (H2O2) is put out on the apidocyte cell in a generally speaking small amount. H2O2 is reactive but, it should be remembered,  also a signaling molecule in it's own right. Individual adipocyte conditions will dictate how some react and being gaseous H2O2 can penetrate cells and diffuse to play out it's roles . In general, H2O2  produced by enzymes outside/on the cell (as opposed to H2O2 generated inside cell cytosols or cell mitochondria) alters conditions setting things up for even more local immunological activity (most understand VAP1's classical adhesion function is to snag immune cell's rolling by in the circulation so they can get into a cell that is imperiled and use H2O2 to innately kill infectious agents).

    If one eats franken-wheat  with a lectin arginine loop and one's VAP1 leu469 gate-keeper is in place (to let it by) you still aren't absolutely doomed to an auto-immune like assault with  reactive H2O2 plaguing your adipose tissue. An unusual genetic quirk down in the  VAP1's enzyme activation site can have a variation of  the usual tyrosine amino in the 471 position (tyrosine471). Without tyrosine471 in the enzymatic well then no topa-quinone is made from  tyrosine and then instead the franken-lectin loop's arginine will just meet up with a phenylalanine molecule instead. And,  conveniently nice for those without topa-quinone down there in that VAP1 enzymatic site no Schiff reaction even starts to go forward &  so no H2O2 on the outside of  that adipose cell instigates the pro-inflammatory circumstances Doc traces back to wheat .

  • steve

    1/5/2012 3:33:27 PM |

    Might-O-Al:
    You said you take no meds, but Niacin at the doses you take would be viewed as a  med, and sexert powerful influence on lipids  in lowering them, and affecting the size of LDL particles.  It also increases the HDL.  I think you experienced all of this, so how much is from carb restriction vs

    Dr Davis:  From my reading it seems unclear that when you lower LDL particle count to say 800 or below, how important the mix is between large and small particles.  I believe this is even stated on the NMR report: "Small LDL-P and LDL size are associated with CVD risk, but not after LDL-P is taken into account".  I believe the writings of many lipidologists seems to say that at low levels of LDL Particles in line with your recommendations, the mix of small and large is not important.
    Might you elaborate on this?

    Thanks,

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/5/2012 5:26:55 PM |

    Hi Steve,
    I don't think I am eating "low" carb - just not a naturally thin person eating unlimited carbs. In fact Doc, a fan of "very" low carb, seems to have been very tolerant of me here when elaborate any  contrarian comments.  I probably simply don't over-eat for my activity level.
    I did try Doc's suggestion to use the finger stick  home blood glucose meter to test how different carb amounts I was including in some of my experimental meals played out. And , putting  credence to his admonition about post prandial glucose "excursions" (spike), reduced some of my core meals' total carbs .
    In those examined daily staple meals (or thin me specifically)  I generally found I felt fine with the reduced carbs and the post prandial blood glucose tests examined at 15 minute intervals showed a more modulated excursion. But when I tried to go with very low carb (15 gr./meal) or even low carb (maybe barely 100 gr. daily) I became gaunt  (so apparently my  hold steady weight/strength is closer to  120 gr. carbs daily).
    I wanted last trial months to be less about precise control in home eating and more to see if modest dining out in the world (I usually work overseas & NMR test not available)  would adversely affect my lipo-protein fractions that Doc's other protocols (fish oil, niacin, vit. D, skip wheat) had started improving. I settled on cheap daily oriental restaurant lunch since cup of rice & fish/veggie cooked in vegetable oil  (with some sugared spice) is pretty much the best I have available to eat in developing countries.
    Agreed, that daily niacin of 2,000 mg is a self-dosing amount & yet is in Doc's upper range for unsupervised use (another practice I thank him for showing me here). To orientate any readers I'd like to be clear that  this is not to say I am blindly recommending such a high dosage.
    After 4 months on 1,500 mg. daily niacin I deliberately had some liver enzyme tests, SGOT (a.k.a. AST) & SGPT (a.k.a ALT), to make sure  I was not provoking unknown damage. When  taking 1,500 mg. daily niacin my  SGOT = 20 Iu/L (ideal = less than 40) & SGPT = 17 (ideal less than 55) makes me feel confident that the last 7 months of  taking 2,000 mg. daily niacin has also been safe, for me.

  • Joe

    1/5/2012 8:27:10 PM |

    @ Might: "There is no current science that adults being real thin is better than being heavier – just the opposite."

    Please define "real thin" and "heavier" and "gaunt" in clinically relevant terms.

    The BMI, while not perfect, provides a pretty good baseline.  In fact, the original studies included smokers (and artificially thin), which biased the results (of course smokers will have a higher mortality rate!) against the low side of "normal."

    "I’m with you on 160 lbs. for 6 footer is too scrawny if the person is healthy"

    I just don't understand a comment like that., Might.  If a person is, by definition, healthy, how or why can he be "too scrawny"?  By what measure?

  • jim

    1/5/2012 9:20:01 PM |

    Hi Might-o'chondri-AL,
    You must have a great job, I cannot afford the NMR so frequently. If you found a cheaper way to get that done, let us know ;)

  • steve

    1/5/2012 10:38:52 PM |

    Might O Al:
    Thanks for your detailed response.  Sounds like you have things under control.  How large are your LDL particles?  For me, mine seem to run on the low side- at 20.6 per NMR and without  very large carb restriction i generate lots of small LDL whether on low or high carb.  Not sure what is going on with the liver or the metabolic issue i might have.  Normal weight at 144 at 5'6", normal thyroid, D, so with a family history of CAD I take a statin and Zetia to control the level of my LDL particles which at last count were 560, but small of 400 with TRGS of only 52.   HDL of 55.  and HDL particles of 35.  Maybe a bit more fat will help the profile.

    From some of what i have read, as LDL particles get to a low level, size does not seem to matter. That is at least to Dr. Dayspring and others.
    Regards,

  • Ronnie

    1/6/2012 12:46:39 AM |

    I originally posted this question in the wrong place.  I know that low carb diets benefit all genotypes, but I've read that APOE 3/4's also need to consume LOW fat diets to lower their heart disease risk (as opposed to moderate fat diets for other genotypes).  Do you agree?

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/6/2012 1:31:56 AM |

    Hi Steve,
    I am not a clinician & since seem endowed with good health  my concerns are different than Doc's patients. People here should remember this is Dr. Davis' blog & he has the cachet to give advice about real medical problems.
    As I've aged there are  physical changes I can detect and some research tells me are silently common. As a  6 foot 136 lb. high school wrestler I hit the mats as  "wiry". At 60, if  my 32 inch waist pants slip, I know  poolside that I look  like a "scrawny" old grey head instead of robustly fit.  
    My work in developing countries show(ed) me I was naturally like the under-privileged locals -  real thin on adequate food intake while working hard.  With age comes vulnerability, so without any body mass reserve (to draw down on) a whip thin "healthy" older person who develops an alarming health problem may (without competent intervention) have to catabolize their muscles for converting into survival energy ; the only thing is, that the aged (unlike the young) are also prone to sarcopenia (muscle loss) .
    I think all can see modern longevity is excellent,  and yet many are even overweight. A 2011 Cordoba Argentina study suggests their older overweight  women had better cognitive function than matched ones with normal BMI . Another  fairly recent report says that older overweight African-american women are more satisfied with their quality of life than matched American females of all  races.
    Doc told us he knows  tri-athalon  competitors who can't train to their satisfaction eating low carb. They would be good models for "health", but apparently they want some reserve -  for at least the upper body strength (all muscle isn't identical) .
    Sorry no precise numbers/definitions were given. If my shaving mirror shows a a tight face hinting at the underlying bones  then I'll eventually weigh myself.  When I get a couple of lbs. back over 160 lbs. I  see some softness in my face, stop looking like am  malnourished & seem to get less easily tapped out using my upper body muscles when life demands it.

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/6/2012 1:53:59 AM |

    Hi Jim,
    $70 NMR online script, your local ( most states legal) blood draw service via iNeedLabs dot com -  not financialy associated. Doc's theories intrigued me .... Since usually am somewhat out in the bush, with rustic medical care, I decided to repeatedly cough up the test money when 1st NMR showed I was way off Doc's mark. I've an abysmal familial cardio-vascular  history that I'd already beat & now feel have a demonstrably (NMR tested) better protocol.

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/6/2012 2:59:41 AM |

    Hi Steve,
    1st NMR (low fat, unmonitored carbs) LDL size = 20.6 (size)
    2nd NMR (up fat, mostly rice, less carbs) LDL "  = 21.1
    3rd NMR (more fat, more niacin, + carbs ) LDL" =   21.3
    (lab calls LDL size of  20.6 to 23 as "large" - so mine got  bigger).

    I don't know if what the doctor you mention is valid. Some investigators contend when LDL gets down to around 60 mg/dL (in that traditional measurement scheme) the conditions are such that LDL can (will?)  be drawn back out  from within the vascular wall intima; and so there is a  mitigation of the amount of cholesterol in that plaque. Maybe this is what Dr. Dayspring is alluding to & presumably the logic would follow that this reduces risk factor ; making LDL cholesterol particle size  irrelevant because even if it is smLDL & prone to cause problems it won't get to accumulate where it shouldn't to the degree it can cause real damage.
    I am not declaring the preceding to be a relevant fact, and have additional issues in light of the following nuance. A  Cochran Group (2009?) independent meta-analysis of years of statin research indcates  that although statins are demonstrably useful helping those who already have had a cardio-vascular event (and survived) the same statins are not statistically proving to prevent someone from having their first cardio-vascular crisis.
    Ideally Doc will address whether LDL particle size can be irrelevant & when.
      .

  • Stephanie

    1/6/2012 1:26:39 PM |

    It is the ketosis that gives me insomnia.  My supplements have been steady for a couple of years and my regimine includes magnesium citrate and citramate.  Does anyone else experience insomnia when in ketosis?  If so, have you found a way to combat it?

  • berger6696

    1/6/2012 3:47:33 PM |

    I really wish this would be addressed in more blog posts.  I will be getting my ApoE results in a few weeks and am highly confident I am not 3/3.   Possibly even 2/4.  Yikes!

  • Gene K

    1/6/2012 3:50:38 PM |

    You can find previous posts on this topic here: http://www.trackyourplaque.com/blog/category/apoprotein-e.

  • Sol y Sombra

    1/6/2012 4:40:20 PM |

    Stephanie, my personal experience is you do not have to be in ketosis to lose weight. Sure, it happens more slowly than while in ketosis, but it does happen. That is, if you keep your carbs between 50 and 100 grams a day (fiber included). What exactly do you mean by "weight loss ceases" - how many pounds do you have to lose and for how long have you plateaued? If it has been less than a month or two since you last saw any weight loss, I don't think you have any reasons to worry just yet. Give your body time to adjust. And maybe start exercising too - try high-intensity interval training and body weight exercises or weight lifting.

  • Joe

    1/6/2012 5:25:29 PM |

    "As a 6 foot 136 lb. high school wrestler I hit the mats as “wiry”. At 60, if my 32 inch waist pants slip, I know poolside that I look like a “scrawny” old grey head instead of robustly fit."

    Again, Might, you seem more concerned with appearance than with health or fitness. Which, of course, you're entitled to do. And so is Jackie. She thinks her husband looks better with 20 more pounds on his frame. Even though he is within the "normal" or "ideal" BMI range, a useful measure of overall health and mortality. That's a good place to be, in my opinion. So I don't see any reason for being concerned about it, which she seems to be (I could be wrong about that, too).

    And if you feel that you look better at the pool with a few more pounds on your own frame, by all means, go for it!

    PS: Just putting a few more pounds (especially if they're just pounds of fat) on your frame won't necessarily keep you from getting "tapped out" when using your upper body muscles, but lifting more weights, more frequently, will.

    PPS: I'd really like to see that study that says African American women are more satisfied with their quality of life than others. It just doesn't compute. Neither does the Cordoba Study, which is refuted by dozens of similar studies.

  • Sol y Sombra

    1/6/2012 5:48:26 PM |

    I'm sorry, you say that if you up your carbs to 100/day, the sleeping problem resolves, but weight loss stops. I think you can try to stick with 100, perhaps up to 120, give yourself time and see if things improve. Many people can lose weight while eating between 100 and 150 g/day.

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/6/2012 7:18:56 PM |

    Hi Joe,
    J. Zilberman, MD, Instituto Cardiovascular de Buenos Aires, Argentina studied 300 post-menopausal Córdoba women, with 52.6 % having obese BMI,  administered Boston Abbreviated Test & Mini-Mental Statement Examination" to  put forth findings "Association Between Menopause, Obesity, and Cognitive Impairment" at Oct. 2011 U. Mississippi conference "Physiology of Cardiovascular Disease: Gender Disparities"  hosted by University of Mississippi  relating that, in +/- 60 year old females those having more BMI correlated with more cognition - including the stipulation that waist width due to obesity (in other words adjusting for limitations of using BMI) postitively, meaning yes in a good way, correlated  with over all cognition. The researchers only speculate the cause of  this female cognitive benefit is because fat holds estrogen ,and so the more fat the more post-menopausal estrogen availability to allay impairment.

    To be clear I am definitely not trying to imply overweight African-american women will have ideal physiological health, yet mental ease has it's benefits for quality of life. If you look at Japan health research you will also find categories beyond raw number measurements. Consider  2011 U. Alabama  report by team of  Dr. T. Cox "Examining the association between body mass index and weight related quality of life in black and white women";  DOI 10.1007/s11482-011-9160-8

    Politely, can I ask you your age?

  • yuma

    1/6/2012 7:45:00 PM |

    Hi Dr. Davis,
    you recommend 40-50 grams of carbohydrates per day, 13-16 per meal, assuming 3 meals per day.
    If I only had 2 meals per day (i.e. intermittent fasting) would I still have only 13-16 C per meal or 20-25?
    If I only had 1 meal per day (i.e. intermittent fasting) would I still have only 13-16 C per meal or 50?
    In other words, does the fasting period compensate for the impact of higher carbs per meal?

    Thanks!

  • TheArcher

    1/6/2012 8:31:52 PM |

    Greetings, Dr. Davis and Track Your Plaque readers,

    I’m a 57-year-old lady who just stopped eating wheat in pursuit of a 40-pound weight loss and more energy. My husband and I like many foods on a low-carb diet.  I don’t miss wheat at the moment, and my husband is coping okay wheatless; but he wonders, in the absence of bread, what he can use to sop up sauces, olive oil, etc. at dinnertime. Surely he’s not the only person who became accustomed to using bread this way.

    I can’t think of a grain-free low-carb substitute. Can anyone else suggest one?

  • steve

    1/6/2012 8:52:07 PM |

    Dr Davis:
    Can you clarify and give us your view as to how important LDL particle size is when total LDL particles are 600 or less?  Thanks.

  • Janknitz

    1/6/2012 9:22:37 PM |

    I miss bread for that particular reason too!   It's about the only time I really, really miss bread.  
    .  I use this recipe http://247lowcarbdiner.blogspot.com/2011/11/bacon-avocado-grilled-cheese-sliders-on.html?m=0 for the coconut "bread" and it's savory and does a good job sopping up all those delicious sauces.

  • Janknitz

    1/6/2012 9:29:16 PM |

    Just had my lipid panels done after about 7 months wheat free and low carb:

    Total Cholesterol:  235
    Triglycerides: 71
    HDL: 79
    LDL: 142 (calculated)
    Pretty darn good, though I'll keep working on getting the Triglycerides down even more.  I didn't have baseline numbers, but I suspect that they were really bad as I'm severely insulin resistant, obese, and was totally inactive before starting.  Insulin resistance is still not where I'd like it to be, but my HbA1C is not bad at 5.8.  All these numbers are 100% due to my wheat free, low carb diet, plus fish oil and Vitamin D3 supplementation.  I'm THRILLED.  

    Added bonus:.  Skeletal pain that was 7 on a scale of 10 every moment is GONE (doctor said it was aging).  Low back pain is gone, and I don't think it really left UNTIL I cut out the wheat.  GERD gone, asthma under the best control ever.  I can walk 2 miles now, I couldn't even walk across a room 6 months ago.  

    It works, it works, it works, it WORKS!

  • Joe

    1/6/2012 10:33:09 PM |

    This works for me:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DX7wrTX8ybQ

    Especially for soaking up egg yokes.

    It also tastes great when toasted, buried in butter and carb-free pancake syrup, with a little cinnamon sprinkled on top.

  • Joe

    1/6/2012 11:02:05 PM |

    Yes, Might, I found the study, and question the results, in light of so many studies that suggest just the opposite is true.  Additionally, it doesn't say anything about men.

    Regarding Alabama study? It concluded pretty much what I expected it to conclude, that "  obesity not only increases risk for morbidity/mortality, but also impacts the quality of life of obese individuals." Yes, I think African American women are more comfortable with obesity and being overweight (a cultural artifact?) than white women (which is probably why they are less healthy and suffer higher rates of mortality than white women), but you suggested this translated to a better "quality of life," and I don't think that's necessarily the case. Too much of a leap, I think.

    About my age?  Sure. Do you want my biological age? That would be 70. So I'm entering my eighth decade on this planet, and feel like I'm still in my 30s. That's mostly because I now look a lot like I did in my early 30s (less most of the hair!), while I was still smoking and still led an active, physical life. I'd rather not talk about my late 30s, 40s, 50s and early 60s, when the wheels came off, and before "I saw the light." Smile

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/7/2012 3:21:42 AM |

    Kudos Joe,
    So you'll like this: in the pool the other day I met a fellow in his early 90's who eventually asks me my age. I tell him 60 & he deadpan's: "I got shoes older than you!"

  • TheArcher

    1/7/2012 8:23:42 AM |

    Thanks for sharing that link. I'll try it. I'll also post back any other solutions I may find.

  • TheArcher

    1/7/2012 8:24:47 AM |

    Many thanks for that, Joe, and also for the other serving suggestions. I'll gladly try it.

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/7/2012 9:09:37 AM |

    Zero body fat is not ideal because healthy adipose tissue gives us adiponectin in circulation. In skeletal muscles adiponectin turns out to increase the skeletal muscle enzyme LPL (for geeks: adiponectin upregulates AMPK, which increases PGC-1alpha & also PPAR alpha leading to increased lipoprotein lipase). This essentially gives the enzymatic ability to break apart VLDL for freeing up some of the triglycerides VLDL carries to bring in it's fatty acids to "burn" in the skeletal muscle cell's  mitochondria for ATP.

    Healthy adipose sending out adiponectin can actually increase the number of mitochondria being made (mitochondrial bio-genesis response is from increased AMPK) and up the potential for "burning" fatty acid  in that muscle cell; this essentially lowers the amount of lipids in muscle tissue; so having some body fat can still help keep muscles mass lean.

    Doc has to oversimplify blogging about carbs and body fat, yet I like his gist. Here's why: high blood glucose causes an intermediate molecule (succinate,  & then it's derivations ) to form that blocks  +/- 25% of  adiponectin from forming  ideally ( in that adipose cell's endoplasmic reticulum). This is detrimental because then target skeletal muscle cells have to make do on less than 10% of  the ideal high molecular weight (HMW) adiponectin than those with healthy adipose get to work with.

    To phrase it simpler,  those whose carb derived blood glucose load is too much for their physiology end up living with a low level of   ideal (HMW) adiponectin (ex. those with metabolic syndrome, obese, type II diabetic). And then there's sparse skeletal muscle LPL  for setting up the steps to get maximal "burning" of one's fats in their skeletal muscle (ie: stamina suffers).

    But then it turns annoying since, as Doc warns, too high a blood glucose (from dietary carb load one can't use up) makes the liver get driven by the carbohydrate response element binding protein (ChREBP) to turn  those excess carbs into triglycerides. And furthermore,  that high level of ChREBP  put into play also causes the person's adipose fat cells to boost expression of  their specific adipose tissue LPL (ie: body switches off skeletal muscle LPL, but turns on adipose LPL). In this situation the result is a lot of  triglycerides end up getting shunted inside of the body's adipose fat tissue cells so fat cells swell.

    At the same time adipose tissue is sucking up triglycerides skeletal muscle LPL is (for the most part) not showing up to work. So most of the post-prandial made triglycerides the VLDL is trying to unload from circulation over to skeletal muscles for use can't be plucked in by their skeletal muscles. One way to look at elevated triglyceride lab results is it (high trigs) indicates that body's adipose tissue isn't forming adiponectin "normally" enough to perform out & about in the other parts of the body. Doc has specified that human body fat (adipose) isn't a victim that passively receives goops of fat, but rather an actor  - like how it should send adiponectin to help skeletal muscles.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:06:54 PM |

    Nicely done, Might!

    Your experience is a perfect example of what can be achieved with diet and some supplements--no drugs!

    The world has been persuaded that statin drugs are the only answer. Your experience shows that you can achieve values that are SUPERIOR to those achievable with drugs.

    I'm going to post your comment as blog post. Thank you!

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:08:16 PM |

    Perhaps we should call it the "Don't eat anything diet," or the "Eat only vegetables diet."

    Dr. Jeff Volek and Dr. Ron Krauss are among the investigators who have already provided validation of these issues using lipoprotein analysis.

  • Deb

    1/7/2012 3:20:41 PM |

    I make the 2 min bread recipe using almond flour.  Basically, its
    1/4 c. almond flour, 1/4 tsp baking soda, 1/4 tsp baking powder, pinch of salt, 1 T oil, 2T heavy cream, and 1 egg.  I mix it in a small square pyrex and bake in the microwave for 2 min.  Then I slice it in half to make it thinner and toast it.  Voila!  It passes for bread and makes a great LC sandwich.  Something like this does make being LC and grain free, a whole lot easier!

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:32:25 PM |

    I wonder if the circadian variation in cortisol is thrown off as you lose weight, e.g. evening surge rather than morning surge.

    Some people in this situation have had success with higher doses of melatonin, e.g., 10-20 mg and/or the Seriphos form of phosphatidylserine.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:35:41 PM |

    Yes, Denise Minger does a great job, citing issues that I would have cited, also.

    As always, nutritional thinking falls into this trap: If something or some practice that is bad is replaced with something less bad, then more of the less bad thing must be good. If the standard American diet is replaced with a plant-based, low-fat diet and there are apparent benefits, then this diet must be the ideal.

    False logic. And the notion that the diet advocated by Esselstyn et al reverses coronary disease is a fiction. This is a whole conversation in itself. Perhaps a topic for future!

  • DonOverEasy

    1/7/2012 3:37:14 PM |

    Dr. Davis,
    I have experience so many benefits since I've been following your dietary suggestions for over a year now.  My question is:  What do I say to the veggie-heads and Ornish followers who claim and ask the question:  If low fat diets really worsen the factors leading to heart disease, please explain why  rural China was so unaffected by heart disease in the 80s?  

    I'm not a scientist or a researcher, and I know low-carb sure works for me, but  how do I respond to this question?  I'd like to be able to provide an intelligent, straight-forward answer to this never-ending argument.   Thank You.

    www.amazon.com/review/R2W7KWZKQY6BGJ/ref=cm_cd_pg_pg128?ie=UTF8&cdForum=FxZJ813G2J60B7&cdPage=128&asin=1439190275&store=books&cdThread=TxCB0L17B0KXSQ#wasThisHelpful

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:38:31 PM |

    Excellent points, Joe. Thank you.

    Also, note that this diet is not calorie-restricted. If you'd like a 3-egg omelet with mozzarella cheese, covered lavishly with olive oil, spinach, mushrooms, and green peppers, have it and go back for seconds.

    Some people who exercise for prolonged periods, however, may require additional carbohydrates, such as a banana or cooked sweet potato or glucose preparation (Goo) in the midst of exercise.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:42:51 PM |

    I pay no mind to what Liposcience says, as the data they use and the concepts followed for crafting "reference ranges" is flawed. I like their service (for the most part; they are quite dysfunctional when it comes to customer service), but I do not agree with some of their information.

    There's too much here to cover in a comment, so suffice it to say that we cannot craft "normal" or "desirable" ranges for endpoints based on cardiovascular events, since events will lag or underestimate what the disease itself is doing, i.e, a measure of atherosclerosis. Also, Liposcience often bases their observations, as do many lipidologists, on values within a population, e.g., calling "normal" the median +/- 2 standard deviations. This is a deeply flawed notion of "normal."

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:43:42 PM |

    No, I do not.

    I believe the cut the fat notion for apo E4 is an oversimplification.

    Perhaps this is worth covering in future.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:44:38 PM |

    No, it does not.

    Hyperglycemia and glycation develops after a specific carbohydrate ingestion and has no "memory" for what was or was not consumed earlier.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:46:16 PM |

    I post recipes on both www.trackyourplaque.com and the Wheat Belly Blog that accompanies the Wheat Belly book: www.wheatbellyblog.com.

    There are also around 35 such recipes in the Wheat Belly book. The next Wheat Belly book, slated for release in early 2013, will contain 150-200 recipes.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:48:03 PM |

    Still important, Steve.

    Note that persistent small LDLs do not occur in isolation, but are often accompanied by postprandial lipoprotein distortions and higher levels of glycation. So persistent small LDL, regardless of the proportion to total LDL, serves as a marker for several metabolic distortions.

    Note that I do not track LDL particle size; I track number of small LDL particles, what I believe is a superior marker.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:49:40 PM |

    Excellent, Jank!

    Also, note that the calculated LDL likely overestimates the true value, a common situation as you get healthier. At some point, an NMR LDL particle number or an apo B will show you the real value and I'll bet it's much lower than the calculated value suggests.

    And that's great on the bony pains.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:50:54 PM |

    HI, Don--

    A topic for future.

    In the meantime, please be sure to read Denise Minger's reanalysis of the China Study data that essentially debunks the entire argument.

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/7/2012 3:53:39 PM |

    Yes, this is a big problem, Bill.

    None of the lipoprotein testing companies talk to each other, leaving us with variable cutoffs for defining 'pattern A" and "pattern B." And there are next to no data with cross-technology comparisons.

    Until that happens, I ignore the semi-arbitrary and often misleading "pattern A" and "pattern B." Instead, use the total small LDL particle value and divide by total LDL and this gives you proportion or percentage small LDL. On VAP, add LDL3 + LDL 4, then divide by "Real" LDL.

  • DonOverEasy

    1/7/2012 4:24:30 PM |

    Thx doc.  I'm looking forward to understanding this better.  My mind is simple...  low carb is either better or it isn't. I know it is for me...  but apparently some people, for whatever reason, thrive on grains and low fat.  Would love to be able to come up w an answer.  Thank u.   Don

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/7/2012 8:10:40 PM |

    Hi DonOverEasy,
        Next time you want to discuss diet theories with your friends show them  that 4 Jan. data  of mine detailed way above.
    The 1st results were for my long  standing life style  (ie: decades of my adult life) of eating high whole grain & low fat to theoretically prevent cardio-vascular problems my family is prone to. I was  "thriving", decent weight, did hard work and never seriously sick  - so everybody said I was a model for healthy diet. I had no symptoms of any bad reaction to any grains, unlike some get.
        But, according to Doc's preventative cardiology practice I was unknowingly burdened with way too much small LDL, even though I didn't have other metabolic issues (ex: spooky triglyceride levels).  I wanted to think maybe the report print out got messed up.  
       Then show  the 2nd lab results for evidence of how the small LDL improved as an  example of when stop being fanatically low fat &  unlimited whole grain (carb). If they say it was not a fluke show them the even better 3rd lab results after 1/2 year eating yet a higher fat intake.
       Of course individuals will differ & so you should ask them for comparison data from their own  NMR  (Doc's preferred lipo-protein test).  If their small LDL is negligible on their low fat  & grain (carb) based diet then that person is probably that way because of genetics; but you'll never be able to prove that of course & good fortune for them.

  • DonOverEasy

    1/8/2012 1:25:39 AM |

    Hi Might-o'chondri-AL,
    Thank you for your time and your reply.  I don't doubt you or your numbers.  My story is similar.  My problem lies with the folks who say we are a minority.  

    They say we are a small percentage of pre-diabetics, who will naturally do well on low carb.  My opponents maintain the vast majority of people thrive on whole grains,  low fat, and high fiber, otherwise  rural China  would have been the "heart disease capitol of the world" in the 1980s.

    I'm aware of Denise Minger and how she has shed light on Dr. Campbell's deceptive studies.  And my own story and dietary changes have proven Dr. Campbell is blowing smoke.  Yet there is truth in that, China has subsisted for thousands of years on high grains and low fat.  Rural China did have a low rate of heart disease.  Why is that?

    There's got to be more to this story.  The vegans maintain Americans are obese not because of whole grains and low fat, but because of an addiction to simple carbohydrates and sugars.  Which truly is part of the problem.  But only part of the problem.  They believe simple carbs and saturated fats are what causes the inflammatory response that has contributed to the masses with heart disease, not whole wheat grains.

    So Al (I presume) I hear you, loud and clear.   I too thrive following a paleo way of life.  I've lose 40 lbs and have great numbers.  But are we the minority?  I became sick on a vegan diet back in the 80s (Ornish), but I have friends (more like acquaintences) who appear to be thriving on a vegan lifestyle.  Again... why is that?

    I continue to search for answers.  Thanks for taking the time.
    Don

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/8/2012 2:33:30 AM |

    Hi Don,
    I worked in many rural developing countries worldwide (like yesteryear's China)  and the majority of the people have (had) no food security. So even if the grain bin was full they had to feed their extended family on the realistic minimum (except for seasonal boons, like edible insect time)  or risk absolute if ate all their seed grain when planting time rains hopefully came back on time .  
    In terms of your context this meant they did not overeat assorted types of calories in relation to how hard their daily physical exertion promptly used those available calories. We are not talking about people who are subsidized with food like the  modern societies make possible -   to put them into their actual context  they were (are) eating by the sweat of their brow. I think there is a blogosphere disconnect with only fasting being our link to subsistence level living;  &  to discard any relationship to "calories in, calories out"  as a sound bite just because modern food availability is pervasive..  
    Rural poor did (do) not eat all their livestock or fowl because it's their only source of  cash income at market and so made do with legumes (ex:beans & bushy pidgeon pea) . There is (was) no refrigeration so the vegetable & fruit crop diversification made it practical to just go with what held up reliably  (ex: cabbage) or grew fast (ex: leafy greens). Cooking traditions in rural cultures was not really an art but a means to conserve things from spoiling until got used (ex: fried makes a barrier, sugar preserves, vinegar  conserves, ferments drop pH dissuades bacteria).
    Rural China's low cardio-vascular disease , looked through Doc's paradigm,  is they never had enough shear over-load  of  inappropriately excessive blood sugar to drive the metabolic aberrations which generate the physical changes in lipids (small LDL , triglycerides) that are cardio-vascular culprits. Doc's blogging puts protein source and fat amounts as not a factor in heart related problems, just what we are taught to worry incorrectly about.
    Have your veganites take an NMR even if they are thin for show and tell.

  • Tim Dietz

    1/8/2012 5:43:22 PM |

    Hi Doc,

    I'm an APOE2/4 and would love to have you cover this subject in more detail.

    Thanks,
    Tim

  • edgar@raw food diet

    1/9/2012 4:07:42 AM |

    Hi Dr. Davis,

    Thank you for confirming that low carbohydrate intake can really reduce the risk of heart attack. I agree that 90% of the time drugs don't help, natural healing is the more better road to take. I will have to read this multiple times so that I can absorb --- this is really interesting.

  • Stacie

    1/10/2012 3:18:02 PM |

    Here is a conundrum maybe someone can help with.  My husband, with CAD, follows a low-carb diet.  Has lost 20-25 lbs, blood pressure is fantastic.  However,weight loss has stalled over the last year.  Triglycerides still too high (319), HDL still too low (38).  Low-carb really has not given him the great results I have been hoping for.  Any ideas?

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/10/2012 9:14:45 PM |

    Hi Stacie,
    This is a sleepy thread by now so Iet me inform you that if you read Doc's  old posts I think you will find him repeatedly saying "...cut out wheat " , even if you are already low carb dieting. Look above to my  5 Jan. elaboration  written "For Iconnolly  ..." of how I suggest wheat may be a stumbling block ,  beyond  wheat just it being a carb.  It may motivate your man to give Doc's advice a try.
    Also,  I refer you to the previous post titled "Mocha Walnut Brownies" where 4 Jan. I wrote "For Laura ..."  in response to your guy's same slump. Please know that, despite my commenting alot,  I am not an authorized spokesman for Doc, nor am I a clinician or medical expert.

  • Stacie

    1/10/2012 9:46:44 PM |

    Hi AL:  

       Thanks for the reply,  We are wheat free, as well as grain free.  I did not understand the post about palmitate.  I think you are saying  to eat less of it.  Our doctor(fantastic low-carb doc)hjas recommended that my husband eat smaller portions of fat, and increase vegetable portion size.  He also has begun  K2, D3, and omega-3 supplementation.  His Apo E genotype is also not good (E2/E4).  I do not know anything about genotype, so do not know what it means.

  • Might-o'chondri-AL

    1/10/2012 11:34:54 PM |

    Hi Stacie,
    Doc tweaks fat intake down for ApoE4 individuals, your physician says smaller fat portions & I detailed why palmitic acid (palmitate) dietary fat comes to my mind to focus on for limiting. In conventional research high fat diets are used on mice to give them problems, like high triglycerides and insulin resistance and palmitate  often comes up as indirectly culpable .
    Since we are all designed to make our own palmitate those with genetic &/or food driven high triglycerides might do better just limiting dietary palmitate as much as possible. The desired amount of saturated fat can be obtained from coconut oil & adding more olive oil, due to it's high oleate fat content, will keep the palmitate benign.
    When one is ApoE2/E4 it means they make and use a type 2 & also type 4 variation of the molecule ApoE. Look at next post  "DIet is Superior to Drugs" & my 10 Jan. comment about triglycerides and ApoE  for  now; & use Doc's  search feature for his words.
    10 Jan.'s focus is on carbs & triglycerides relationship with ApoE. In your case just ignore the carb phase minutia & interject  your husband's high triglycerides into the overall dynamic laid out. People can have genetic influences on triglyceride levels & this seems to be what you must deal with.
    ApoE nuances  relationship with triglyceride coping suggests to me getting dietary fat without the palmitate found in meat/whole dairy. Of course that is hard to jibe with the nicer idea of eat all the meat you want; but maybe worth a trial.

  • Stacie

    1/11/2012 8:19:10 PM |

    Thank you Al.  I read those posts.  My understanding, then, is that  because  of the E2/E4, my husband is carb and fat sensitive.  Great combo!  I guess he is busted.  He hates coconut oil,  but olive oil is okay.  We will follow our doctor's advice, eat more vegetables and less meat.  I am also hoping the D3, K2, and fish oil will help.  Here is the bottom line for us:  We will do the best we can diet wise,  not worry or obsess about food, love each other, and above all, trust God.

  • Ronnie

    1/13/2012 12:30:49 AM |

    I've always been fit and thought I was keeping myself safe from heart disease with my 10 mg Zocor prescription for the past 8 years along with exercise and trying to eat somewhat "healthy"  (TC under 200 with the zocor, triglycerides and LDL's under 100 and HDL around 70; my weight is 109, female, age 60).  But my new doctor did NMR on me and I was shocked.  I found out that I'm APOE 3/4, my ApoB was 100 and LDL-P 1206, HDL 72, TR 115.  Since then I've added Slo Niacin (500 mg to start), my doctor upped my zocor to 20 mg (from what I've read, APOE 4's don't respond as well to statins except maybe for simvastatin), cut my carbs and fat intake.  My next NMR will be in March.  Meanwhile, I sort of feel that as an APOE 4 I'm doomed to some level of heart disease, regardless of my numbers.  I've always been a negative person anyway....can you help allay my fears?

  • Pamela Andrews

    1/13/2012 1:57:34 AM |

    Dr. Davis, After my doctor took me off glimeperide December 16, 2011 my blood sugars rebounded upward even though at the time I was low carb and avoiding wheat.  I never lost but ten to twelve pounds on the Wheat Belly diet but followed your advice anyway because the arthritis symptoms cleared up nicely and also because of so much cardiovascular heritage on my Dad's side of family.  Just this past week I called my doctor again because my blood sugars were very unsatisfactory (FBS of 170 in the morning and 209 between meals).  He allowed me to try just one half of one mg. of the glimeperide.  At about the same time I began to read about Dr. John McDougall on the internet and at first dismissed him but noticed that in his most recent book, the McDougall Plan for Rapid Weight Loss, 1995, he too warns readers to avoid all flour products, breads etc.  So, I have NOT returned to eating wheat but have started trying to avoid meat and fats for a while, just to see what would happen (I have never tried this before, to go without meat).  Some good news:  My fasting blood sugar in less than 72 hours has gone down to 114 and the chest pain and arrythmias have gone away.  Maybe I am sensitive to both carbohydrates AND meats/fats.  Decided to put this on this blog instead of Wheat Belly facebook or blog because of feeling like perhaps I am in a minority.

  • Gene K

    1/13/2012 5:14:37 AM |

    Ronnie,
    I will let Dr Davis answer your question, but I wanted to give you some good news. I am an APOE 3/4 and my family heart disease history is terrible. I started off with an OK lipid profile (according to my PCP; I was taking Lipitor), but my NMR turned out quite bad and getting worse over time. My calcium score at that time (February 2010) was 209. Thanks to Dr Davis, with the correctly tuned diet, supplement, and exercise program, I was able to bring my NMR indicators to a very favorable range, and my calcium score in September 2011 was 191 (10% reduction). And yes, I have to take statins (Crestor 10mg). I can provide more details, but just wanted to encourage you that you are not doomed, simply because you are an APOE 4, so please do not give up!

  • JC

    1/13/2012 1:24:55 PM |

    False logic. And the notion that the diet advocated by Esselstyn et al reverses coronary disease is a fiction. This is a whole conversation in itself. Perhaps a topic for future!

    I can't wait for that conversation.Very soon I hope.

  • Ronnie

    1/13/2012 10:50:45 PM |

    Thank you for that, Gene.  I still haven't gotten over the inital shock of finding out my genotype.  It surprised me because neither one of my parents have/had heart disease.  But my fraternal twin sister has CAD which I attributed to very poor diet and sedentary lifestyle.  I'm guessing she's also APOE 4. Thanks again.

  • Ronnie

    1/13/2012 10:54:05 PM |

    Also, Gene, whatever details you care to share would be helpful and appreciated. Ronnie

  • Gene K

    1/16/2012 3:34:12 AM |

    I described the diet, which took me from my worst NMR in November 2010, to a significant improvement in March 2011, and finally to an excellent NMR in September 2011 (small LDL #P less than 90 nmol/L) and a 10% reduction in my calcium score, in my comment at http://www.trackyourplaque.com/blog/2011/07/the-exception-to-low-carb.html#comment-23722. I followed this diet meticulously. I was taking 2400 mg (EPA+DPA) fish oil, 8000 iu vit D3, 675 mcg iodine in kelp tablets. Following Dr Davis's advice, after finding out in December 2011 that I was APOE 4,3, I added Niacine 500 mg and Crestor 10 mg (all doses are daily). I also significantly reduced plant oils in my diet. Today I am experimenting with my diet trying to add fats such as 100% baking chocolate and coconut oil. (Don't know the results yet.) I also walk for 1 hr every day (from home to train and back, and some during the lunch break) and exercise 3 days a week doing interval training (HIIT) for 20 min and following the slow burn strength resistance program.

  • Gene K

    1/16/2012 3:43:52 AM |

    Please read other comments to that post on 7/31/2011. Especially, pay attention to Dr Jack Kruse's comment. His blog at http://jackkruse.com/jacks-blog/ is very relevant, dense, insightful, and useful. I never miss his posts (nor do I Dr Davis's).

  • Ronnie

    1/16/2012 3:04:44 PM |

    Gene, thank you very much.  I plan to read everything this evening.  Congratulations on all your hard work and effort regarding diet, exercise and supplementation.  I do have a question regarding your fish oil.  In the NMR I received, the notes said that "one study demonstrated ApoE4 patients had a 15.9% increase in LDL cholesterol in response to fish oil.  This needs to be confirmed in a larger study".  Do you know anything about this?  I take 1000 mg fish oil daily.  Also, I have another question which shows my ignorance regarding all of this.  My NMR said I is am 3/4; you write you are 4,3.  Does the order of the numbers make any difference?  Thanks again.

  • Gene K

    1/16/2012 7:08:08 PM |

    Ronnie, I have no background in the medical field, so I am trying to limit the content of my posts to the links to sources from which I learned and the facts of my own experience. I would defer answers to Dr Davis or somebody else who knows.
    The spelling APOE 3,4 is purely mine and I don't know whether the order or punctuation have any meaning here. To me, it doesn't matter.
    To find out more about the fish oil, read earlier posts by Dr Davis here: http://www.trackyourplaque.com/blog/category/fish-oil. You can also find the following post by Dr Kruse (including the comments) useful: http://jackkruse.com/is-fish-oil-good-or-bad/.

  • Ronnie

    1/17/2012 3:33:59 AM |

    A lot of great information on this blog.  Thank you, Gene, for the links and Dr. Davis, for your response.

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  • Bill

    8/15/2012 8:33:36 PM |

    Dr. Davis,
    I read about a Harvard medical study: "Low-carb diets linked to atherosclerosis and impaired blood vessel growth".
    http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2009/08/low-carb-diets-linked-to-atherosclerosis-and-impaired-blood-vessel-growth/
    The article said, "...mice placed on a 12-week low-carbohydrate/high-protein diet showed a significant increase in atherosclerosis, ... The findings also showed that the diet led to an impaired ability to form new blood vessels in tissues deprived of blood flow, as might occur during a heart attack."
    I hope you will read this article and give your opinion about "how" they conducted their test.  
    Thanks

  • adam

    10/10/2012 8:53:33 PM |

    Does anyone know how to reach TYP member Gene K who posted on this thread?   I would like the  link to Gene's diet that he followed for Apoe3/4  but the link that was posted earlier does not work, if you are out there Gene, or anyone, please email me diet at

    dbm1st@airmail.net

    Regards

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