Mediterranean diet and blood sugar


Data such as that from the Lyon Heart Study have demonstrated that a so-called Mediterranean diet substantially reduces risk for heart attack.

But there are aspects of the Mediterranean diet and lifestyle that are not entirely sorted out.

For instance, what specific component(s) of the diet provide the benefit? Is it olive oil and linolenic acid? Is it red wine? Is it the reduced exposure to processed snack foods that Americans are indundated with? Is it their more slender builds and greater tendency to walk? How about exposure to the Mediterranean sun? What about the inclusion of breads, since in the Track Your Plaque program I advocate elimination of wheat products for many abnormalities?

Anyway, here's a wonderfully thoughtful set of observations from Anna about her experiences traveling Italy, trying to understand the details of the Mediterranean diet while also trying to keep blood sugar under control.


I just returned from a two week stay in Italy, doing a bit of my own "Mediterranean Diet" experiments. When practical, we sought out food sources and places to eat that were typical for the local area, and tried as much as possible/practical to stay away from establishments that mostly catered to tourist tastes. I was really curious to see how the mythical "Mediterranean Diet" we Americans are urged to follow compared to the foods really consumed in Italy.

The first week, we stayed in a rural Tuscan farmhouse apartment (agriturismo), so many, if not most of our meals were prepared by me with ingredients I bought at the local grocery store (Coop) or the outdoor market in Siena. In addition, I purchased really fantastic free-range eggs from the farm where we were staying. (Between some language issues and seasonality, eggs and wine were what we could buy from them - though I was tantalized by the not-quite-ripe figs heavy on many trees). Mostly, our meals consisted of simple and easily prepared fresh fruits and vegetables, rustic cured meats (salami, proscuitto, pancetta, etc.) hand-sliced at the deli down the road, fresh sausages, various Italian cheeses, plus plenty of espresso. It was a bit disappointing to find underripe fruit & tomatoes as well as old green beans in the grocery stores, not to mention too many low fat and highly processed foods, but all over Europe the food supply is becoming more industrialized, more centralized, and homogenous, so I'm not too surprised that it happens even in Italy. But even with the smaller grocery store size, the amount of in-season produce was abundant, yet one still was better off shipping from the perimeter of the store, venturing into the aisles only for spices, olive oil, vinegar, coffee, etc. Without the knowledge of where to go and the language to really talk in depth about food with people, I wasn't able to find truly direct and local sources for as many foods as I would have liked, but still, we ate well enough!

The first week I maintained blood sugar levels very similar to those I get at home, because except for the Italian specialties, we ate much like we always do. A few rare exceptions to my normal BG tests were after indulging in locally made gelato or a evening limoncello cordial, but even then, the BG rise was relatively modest and to me, acceptable under the circumstance. Even with the gelato indulgences, it felt like I might have even lost a few pounds by the end of the first week and my FBG didn't rise much over 100.

The second week we stayed in two cities (Florence & Rome), and I didn't prepare any of my own food because I didn't have a kitchen/fridge. I found it impossible to get eggs anywhere for breakfast, and the tickets our hotels provided for a "continental" breakfast at a nearby café/bar was always for a coffee or hot chocolate drink and some sort of bread or roll (croissant, brioche, danish, etc.). At first I just paid extra for a plate of salami and cheese if that was available - or went to a small grocery store for some plain yogurt, but then I decided to go off low-carb and conduct a short term experiment, though I didn't consume nearly as many carbs as a typical Italian or tourist would.

So I breakfasted with a brioche roll or plain croissant for breakfast with my cappuccino, but unfortunately no additional butter was available. I didn't feel "full" enough with such a breakfast and I was usually starving an hour or two later. Additionally, when I ate the "continental" breakfast, I noticed immediate water retention - my ankles, lower legs, and knees looked like someone else's at the end of a day walking and sightseeing, swollen heavy. Exercising my feet and lower legs while waiting in lines or sitting didn't seem to help.

Food is much more expensive in Europe than in the US, and the declining US$ made everything especially expensive (not to mention the higher cost of dining out rather than cooking at home), so we tried to manage food costs by eating simple lunches at local take-away places, avoiding the corporate fast food chains. I was getting tired of salami/proscuitto & cheese plates, but the typical "quick" option was usually a panini (sandwich). At first I tried to find alternatives to paninis, but the available salads were designed for side dishes, not main meals and rarely had any protein, and the fillings of the expensive sandwiches were too skimpy to just eat without the bread. So I started to eat panini, although I sometimes removed as much as half of the bread (though it was nearly always very excellent quality pan toasted flatbreads or crusty baguette rolls, not sliced America bread). So of course, my post-prandial BGs rose, as did my FBG. I also found my hunger tended to come back much too soon and I think overall I ate more than usual in terms of volume.

Then we deviated from the "Italian" lunch foods and found a better midday meal option (quick, cheaper, and easier to customize for LC) - stopping at one of the numerous kebab shops and ordering a kebab plate with salad, hold the bread (not Italian, but still Mediterranean, I guess). I felt much better fueled on kebab plates (more filling and enough protein) than paninis, though I must say I still appreciated the taste of caprese paninis (slices of fresh mozzerella and tomato, basil leaves, mustard dressing on crusty, pan-toasted flat bread). If I followed my appetite, I could have eaten two caprese paninis.

We had some great evening dinners, at places also frequented by locals. This often was a fixed price dinner of several courses ("we feed you what we want you to eat"). Multi-course meals included house wine, and invariably consisted of antipasta (usually LC, such as a cold meat and cheese plate), pasta course (much smaller servings than typical US pasta dishes), main course plus some side vegetables, and dessert/coffee. These were often the best meals we experienced, full of local flavor and tradition (sometimes with a grandmotherly type doing the cooking), and definitely of very good quality, though we noticed the saltiness overall tended to be on the high side. I ate from every course, including some of the excellent bread (dipped in plenty of olive oil) and usually about half of the pasta served (2 oz dry?), plus about half of the dessert. After these meals I always ran BGs higher than usual, varying from moderately high (120-160 - at home I would consider this very high for me) to very high (over 180). By late in the week, my FBG was into the 115 range every morning (usually I can keep it 90-100 on LC food). Nearly everything that week was delicious, well-prepared food, but the high carb items definitely were not good for my BG control in the long run.

And most days I was doing plenty of walking, sprinting for the Metro subway trains, stair climbing (4th and 5/6th floor hotel rooms!), etc. but since I didn't have my usual housework to do, it probably wasn't too different from my usual exertion level.

So it was very interesting to experience the "Mediterranean Diet" first hand. Meats and cheeses were plentiful, fruits and vegetables played a much more minor role (main courses didn't come with vegetables other than what was in the sauce, but had to be ordered as additional items), but the overall carbs were decidedly too many. As I expected, it wasn't nearly as pasta-heavy as is portrayed in the US media/health press, but it is still full of too much grain and sugar, IMO. Low fat has become the norm in many dairy products, sadly, and if the grocery stores are any indication, modern families are gravitating towards highly processed, industrial foods. Sugar seems to be in everything (I quickly learned to order my caffe freddo con panno or latte sensa zuccero - iced coffee with cream or milk without sugar) after realizing that adding lots of sugar was the norm).

And, after several days of breakfasting at the café near our Rome hotel (where carbs were the only option in the morning), I learned that our very buff, muscular, very flat-stomached, café owner doesn't eat pasta (said as he proudly patted his 6 pack abs). I probably could have stuck closer to the carb intake I know works better for my BG control, but I figured if I was going to go off my LC way of eating and experiment, this was the time and place.

And yes, there were far fewer really obese people than in the US and lots of very slender people, but I could still see there were *plenty* of overweight, probably pre-diabetic and diabetic Italians (very visible problems with lower extremities, ranging from what looked like diabetic skin issues, walking problems, acanthosis nigricans, etc.). Older people do seem to be generally more fit than in the US (fit from everyday life, not exercise regimes), but there were plenty of "wheat bellies" on men old and young, even more young women with "muffin tops", and simply too many overweight children (very worrisome trend). So it may well be more the relaxed Italian way of living life (or a combination of other factors such as less air conditioning, strong family bonds, lots of sun, etc?) that keeps Italian CVD rates lower than the American rates, more than the mythical "Mediterranean diet".

Comments (6) -

  • Zute

    7/30/2008 8:42:00 PM |

    Even between the Italian countryside and city you can see the broad difference in a "Mediterranean diet" but what about between Sardinia and Italy or Greece or the many other regions.  I think in Greece it is a lot of lamb and fish and veggies and not much in the way of grains.  

    To me, this whole concept is just another silly thing generated by misguided doctors and greedy marketeers.  I'm sure we'll be seeing "Mediterranean Diet Approved" labels on breakfast cereals someday.  *sigh*

  • Alan

    7/30/2008 9:09:00 PM |

    G'day Anna, via Dr Davis

    You brought back memories of my own wanders in Europe while managing BGs, thanks.

    Just a brief comment on definitions. You wrote "Then we deviated from the "Italian" lunch foods and found a better midday meal option (quick, cheaper, and easier to customize for LC) - stopping at one of the numerous kebab shops and ordering a kebab plate with salad, hold the bread (not Italian, but still Mediterranean, I guess)."

    That is part of the difficulty; the various papers recently are based on an American understanding of the "Mediterranean" diet. Some are based on old studies from Crete, others from Corfu, others simply add olive oil or wine as Dr Davis notes. The Mediterranean littoral has diets which vary enormously from Moroccan to Libyan to Egyptian to Turkish to Greek to Albanian to Italian to French to Spanish and all the small nations and islands nearby.  

    I think you sensed the real Mediterranean difference, and that is disappearing. The rustic Mediterranean diet, with local produce, locally farmed and killed animals and local processing and production of cheeses, sausages and breads eaten by people who walk to work is part of that. That diet isn't just Mediterranean, it's simply rural. It has also mostly disappeared from our own cultures.

    Of course, we can't turn back the clock because the reduction in farm production would lead to famine. However, one thing we can do is start reducing our personal purchases of over-processed foods in the supermarket and start searching a little harder for local products such as free-range eggs, fresh fruits and farm-fresh vegetables in season, range-raised animals and similar products.

  • Jonathan Shewchuk

    7/31/2008 4:41:00 AM |

    What specific component of the Lyon Heart Study diet provided the cardiovascular benefit?  The most likely explanation I've seen is that it was the higher ratio of omega-3 to omega-6 fats in the "Mediterranean Diet", largely on account of a special margarine that was provided by the researchers to the Mediterranean dieters.  Details here:

    http://high-fat-nutrition.blogspot.com/2008/01/mediterranean-france.html

    I've seen lots of writing pointing out the disparities between what Americans (and researchers in Lyon) conceive to be the "Mediterranean diet" and what's actually eaten around the Mediterranean.  One example:

    http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/uncategorized/a-tuscan-feast/

    Jonathan

  • Anne

    7/31/2008 9:13:00 AM |

    I enjoyed Anna's account of her experiences of the Mediterranean diet whilst on holiday on Italy. Such a shame she didn't pop over the border into France for a week or so. Having a house in France and relatives in Italy I can say from first hand experience that the food available in the stores, markets and restaurants in France is better than Italy when it comes to fresh fruit and veggies, meats, fish, and those lower carb foods which help our blood sugars (I am diabetic too) and hearts.

    The Coop where Anna shopped the first week made me smile. It reminds me how the Italians do not like, on the whole, to shop in supermarkets.  I don't think I've ever seen another supermarket chain other than the Coop in Italy ! Most Italian housewives shop in small local shops or in markets on market days, and that will explain the poor fruit and veggies in the Coop....a very dismal store. Go across the border to France and, although the French still like to shop at fresh markets and smaller shops, their supermarkets and hypermarkets are rather splendid for fresh fruit and veggies, and fresh fish and meat, as well as the usual things. The French too are increasing their intake of junk foods, but I don't think as much as the Italians who have always enjoyed bready things like paninis, cakes and sweets. The French do have their bread but it is much more crusty and full of air. Breakfasts in France are not suitable for a diabetic either being carbohydrate affairs as in Italy, but doing self catering, as in Anna's first week gets round that. Mind you, some French hotels are now providing self service breakfasts where you can help yourself to eggs, ham and fruit if you don't want the usual croissants and bread. French 'fast food', ie caféterias (caféterias are often attached to hypermarkets) or brasseries are excellent places to get good quality low carb food...freshly cooked steak with vegetables are easily obtained everywhere. I hardly ever have problems with my blood sugar in France.

    I believe the French have a lower incidence of heart disease than other Mediterranean countries...let's hope they keep it up. You see more fat French than there used to be but much fewer than in the UK (where I come from) and fewer than in Italy. There's a Mediterranean diet and a Mediterranean diet !

    Anne

  • Kevin

    7/31/2008 5:32:00 PM |

    As an army brat we spent a lot of time in Italy. Maybe it's different now but I remember whenever there was bread on the table there was also a bowl of olive oil.  Bread was torn into morsel sizes, dipped in olive oil and eaten.  I think on a weight-basis more olive oil than bread was consumed.

  • Anna

    7/31/2008 7:08:00 PM |

    zute, alan, jonathan, anne, & Dr. Davis,

    Why is it I can find so many people that "get it" online but hardly any in my own circles do (though I am gradually changing some minds)?  It's so frustrating to constantly hear the "Mediterranean diet" in the US inaccurately defined by Italy generically (and as some of you point out, largely excluding the other distinct diets that ring that area), and dominated by grain consumption, olive oil (with references to low animal fat & protein consumption, which is *not* necessarily accurate) and though produce is often mentioned and advocated, other than tomatoes, produce isn't isn't what most people load up on when they adopt "Mediterranean" ways.

    Zute, I fear you are correct, in that there is a huge profit motive in the over-marketing of many foods even remotely connected to the "Mediterranean" diet.  There certainly have been huge scandals over Italian olive oils for export (much of the Mediterranean olives are produced outside of Italy, but they go through Italy for pressing, bottling, and  distribution, and there is much fraud in the labeling/accuracy, especially with the pricier extra virgin OO designation).  I've no doubt there are numerous other ways various health claims are distorted for profit.  Dr. Davis has mentioned a number of them in several posts.  it takes a skeptical mind these days, doesn't it?

    Jonathan, I remember well the great, tantalizing photos of the low carb Italian food on Dr. Eades' blog last year, and often mentioned those to people who teased me prior to the trip about managing my low carb requirements while in Italy.  

    Being a short-term tourist brings about a necessary need to adapt standards to a certain degree, which is why we shopped more in Coops/Pam supermarkets (Pam was farther but open on Sundays) while we were preparing our own meals (easier to find and saved time for sightseeing and family visiting) instead of local markets, and we dined out while in hotels.  The kitchen in the farm apartment didn't even have a decent cheese grater or sharp knife so I purchased those and left them behind for future tourist tenants.  And of the 6 adults (of 9 family members), I was the only one interested in doing any cooking while we were in the countryside (a role I gladly took on).  One of my SILs is a chef in Norway, and she understandably wanted a vacation from cooking.

    My other SIL lived in Paris for 14 years (now back in London 12 years) and she many times said the Italian produce we encountered (she especially complained about the underripe fruit) didn't compare to French produce, which echos what Anne describes, as well as my own experiences during earlier travels to Brittany and Paris.  I never know where our next trip will be (usually determined by my husband's meeting locations or invitations from his friends and colleagues), but I always enjoy going to France, despite the complete inadequacy of my junior high school French level.  Haven't been to the southern part yet, though.

    And I think Alan hit the nail on the head with his description of the so-called various Mediterranean diets being "simply rural" diets (which to me implies local, seasonal, varied, and produced more in harmony with nature no matter where in the world), much like my rural Pennsylvanian great-grandmother's diet (I'm quite sure she never saw olive oil, gorgonzola, or an eggplant).  It was nice to reinforce that I can and already do create a largely "rural diet" for my family in my own locale (Southern California), which in many ways is similar to many parts of the Mediterranean region.   My small fig tree is now loaded with fruit, and the first one ripened just two days ago!  I have the chevre and walnuts ready!  Now that I have seen how small they can be, I  plan to get a olive tree or two, for the olive fruits as much as the beauty of the tree (plus I am a lazy gardener of edibles!).

    BTW, we only really had one "dud" dinner meal that was an expensive mistake (ordering "traditional" dishes), at a restaurant in Florence.   It was hard to determine quality based on price, as nearly all dinners were on the expensive side.  Our other full restaurant dinners were excellent (although I recommend skipping the pasta course).  If anyone is interested, I have recommendations for some places a tiny bit off the beaten track:  one in Florence, one in Siena (where the 9 of us had a celebratory dinner for my MIL's 80th year near the incomparable Il Campo square), and two in Rome (one specialized in "the fifth quarter" for those who appreciate that).  All were in the Rick Steve's italy book (but so was the "dud").  I'll probably be posting the names and locations on my own blog, along with meal photos sometime in the next week or two.

    Anyway, nice to read your comments on my experiences.  Good to know I am not the only one who explores the world with my stomach, too. Smile

Loading
Hospitals are a hell of a place to get sick

Hospitals are a hell of a place to get sick

I answered a page from a hospital nurse recently one evening while having dinner with the family.

RN: "This is Lonnie. I'm a nurse at _____ Hospital. I've got one of your patients here, Mrs. Carole Simpson. She's here for a knee replacement with Dr. Johnson. She says she's taking 12,000 units of vitamin D every day. That can't be right! So I'm calling to verify."

WD: "That's right. We gauge patients' vitamin D needs by blood levels of vitamin D. Carole has had perfect levels of vitamin D on that dose."

RN: "The pharmacist says he can replace it with a 50,000 unit tablet."

WD: "Well, go ahead while Carole's in the hospital. I'll just put her back on the real stuff when she leaves."

RN: "But the pharmacist says this is better and she won't have to take so many capsules. She takes six 2,000 unit capsules a day."

WD: "The 50,000 units you and the pharmacist are talking about is vitamin D2, or ergocalciferol, a non-human form. Carole is taking vitamin D3, or cholecalciferol, the human form. The last time I checked, Carole was human."

RN: (Long pause.) Can we just give her the 50,000 unit tablet?

WD: "Yes, you can. But you actually don't need to. In fact, it probably won't hurt anything to just hold the vitamin D altogether for the 3 days she's in the hospital, since the half-life of vitamin D is about 8 weeks. Her blood level will barely change by just holding it for 3 days, then resuming when she's discharged."

RN: (Another long pause.) Uh, okay. Can we just give her the 50,000 units?"

WD: "Yes, you can. No harm will be done. It's simply a less effective form. To be honest, once Carole leaves the hospital, I will just put her back on the vitamin D that she was taking."

RN: "Dr. Johnson was worried that it might make her bleed during surgery. Shouldn't we just stop it?"

WD: "No. Vitamin D has no effect on blood coagulation. So there's no concern about perioperative bleeding."

RN: "The pharmacist said the 50,000 unit tablet was better, also, because it's the prescription form, not an over-the-counter form."

WD: "I can only tell you that Carole has had perfect blood levels on the over-the-counter preparation she was taking. It works just fine."

RN: "Okay. I guess we''ll just give her the 50,000 unit tablet."


From the alarm it raises trying to administer nutritional supplements in a hospital, you'd think that Osama Bin Laden had been spotted on the premises.

I laugh about this every time it happens: A patient gets hospitalized for whatever reason and the hospital staff see the supplement list with vitamin D, fish oil at high doses, iodine, etc. and they panic. They tell the patient about bleeding, cancer, and death, issue stern warnings about how unreliable and dangerous nutritional supplements can be.

My view is the exact opposite: Nutritional supplements are a wonderful, incredibly varied, and effective array of substances that, when used properly, can provide all manner of benefits. While there are selected instances in which nutritional supplements do, indeed, have interactions with treatments provided in hospitals (e.g., Valerian root and general anesthesia), the vast majority of supplements have none.

Comments (19) -

  • Jessica

    10/29/2009 12:25:04 AM |

    We use an EMR and recently on the online forum for the EMR, an MD posted a question about an error message he received when he transmitted an rx electronically to the pharmacy.

    He said he had written for 50,000 IU of Vitamin D (weekly x 8 weeks) and during the transmission, the comma was dropped so the pharmacist received a RX that only read "50 IU."

    The MD posted the issue b/c he wanted to know if others were having the same problem with RXs that contained a comma.

    I replied to the post and answered his technical question, but was disappointed in his choice for intervention. I didn't reply with any info about D2 versus D3 (who am I to educate a physician about medicine?) but in hindsight, I probably should have. Who knows how many other people will receive suboptimal Vitamin D treatment.

    P.S. If you need a good laugh, grab a copy of the latest AFP magazine and read the D article. Their suggested intervention for D deficiency....50,000 IU D2 for 8 weeks. Yauzers.

    I might keep the article for historical significance. My hope is that in just a few short years, we'll look back on such non-sense and be proud of how far we've come with treating D.

    P.P.S. I'm going to the Vitamin D conf in Toronto on Tuesday! I cannot wait!!

  • Anonymous

    10/29/2009 2:40:01 AM |

    The way the nurse kept asking if it was okay to have the patient take the D2 tablets, I couldn't help wonder if the pharmacist was getting a kick back for those tablets. What also bugged me was how she didn't want to "hear" or honor what you had to say even though you are the patient's doctor. Not good.

  • Dots

    10/29/2009 5:00:34 AM |

    I'd LOL if it weren't so sad.

    BTW, I've gotten two doctor neighbors and family on vitamin D and probiotics.  One is egotistical, the other grateful.  Thanks for all you do.

  • Mark K. Sprengel

    10/29/2009 5:25:16 AM |

    So they needlessly increased her costs? Great :/

  • moblogs

    10/29/2009 10:31:29 AM |

    You know, I don't bother telling doctors exactly how much D3 I'm taking. I just get them to check my blood levels and they see no problems with the results. But they would probably balk at the fact I take 10k per day.

  • Helena

    10/29/2009 1:38:59 PM |

    I am a bit disgusted about this whole thing. This shows ones again how stupid the whole industry is… I was just recently at my doctor to take a few tests after some horrible years on the birth control pill Yasmin (it had basically taken me 7 years to put two and two together because no doctor would believe my symptoms well at least not connect them to the birth control). He asked me why I was taking all these vitamins and supplements – Preventive maintenance, was my answer. No comment back except for a smirk. Well yesterday they called me to tell me that everything was ok, but didn’t understand why I wanted to see my own lab results… the woman I was speaking to almost questioned my motive for wanting to see it. What the heck is wrong here… ???

  • Anonymous

    10/29/2009 1:54:06 PM |

    Nutrient Biomarkers Analytical Methodology: Vitamin D Workshop
    The National Institutes of Health (NIH) Office of Dietary Supplements (ODS) is sponsoring the Nutrient Biomarkers Analytical Methodology: Vitamin D Workshop on Wednesday, December 16, 2009 at the Bethesda North Marriott Hotel & Conference Center, Bethesda, Maryland.


    Workshop Summary
    Vitamin D is a fat-soluble vitamin that is naturally present in very few foods, added to others, and available as a dietary supplement. It is also produced endogenously when ultraviolet rays from sunlight strike the skin and trigger vitamin D synthesis. Vitamin D obtained from sun exposure, food, and supplements is biologically inert and must undergo two hydroxylations in the body for activation. The first occurs in the liver and converts vitamin D to 25-hydroxyvitamin D [25(OH)D], also known as calcidiol. The second occurs primarily in the kidney and forms the physiologically active 1,25-dihydroxyvitamin D [1,25(OH)2D], also known as calcitriol.

    Serum concentration of 25(OH)D is the best indicator of exposure to vitamin D from all sources. It reflects vitamin D produced cutaneously and that obtained from food and supplements. There is considerable discussion of the serum concentrations of 25(OH)D associated with deficiency (e.g., rickets), adequacy for bone health, and optimal overall health. In fact, different assay methods are used to assess 25(OH)D. The methods themselves vary and there are considerable differences among laboratory results even when they use the same method.

    Given the uncertainties in vitamin D measurement, the NIH/ODS will host this one-day workshop to evaluate the state of analytical methods. The intent of the Nutrient Biomarkers Analytical Methodology: Vitamin D Workshop is to develop strategies for resolving inconsistencies between results obtained following quantitative determination of selected nutrients in biological materials such as serum when different measurement techniques are used. The desired outcomes of this meeting are to identify strengths and weaknesses of analytical approaches available for the quantification of the nutritional biomarker of Vitamin D status, circulating 25(OH)D in biological samples and to discuss analytical methods, including criteria for selection of method(s); role of reference methods and samples; sample preparation and interpretation of results.

    The workshop will consist of a series of short, focused podium presentations interspersed with open discussion sessions on the currently available analytical methods and interpretation of findings. A final session will summarize the discussions, identify knowledge gaps, and suggest a research agenda for future studies.


    Registration
    Space is limited and will be filled on a first-come first-served basis. There is no registration fee to attend the workshop. To register please forward your name and complete mailing address including phone number via e-mail to Ms. Tricia Wallich at twallich@csionweb.com. Ms. Wallich will be coordinating the registration for this meeting. If you wish to make an oral presentation during the meeting, you must indicate this when you register and submit the following information: (1) a brief written statement of the general nature of the comments that you wish to present, (2) the name and address of the person(s) who will give the presentation, and (3) the approximate length of time that you are requesting for your presentation. Depending on the number of people who register to make presentations, we may have to limit the time allotted for each presentation. If you don't have access to e-mail please call Ms. Wallich at 301-670-0270.


    Workshop Details
    Agenda

    Meeting Location:

    Bethesda North Marriott Hotel & Conference Center
    5701 Marinelli Road
    North Bethesda, MD 20852
    Phone: 301-822-9200
    Website: http://bethesdanorthmarriott.com

    http://ods.od.nih.gov
    What profit is there for one to gain the whole world yet lose or forfeit himself? Luke 9:25

  • Adam Wilk

    10/29/2009 5:17:57 PM |

    Dr. Davis,
    Great post, I enjoyed the way you wrote the dialogue between you and the nurse at the hospital--very, very realistic, and kind of spooky at the same time.  Unfortunately, this is just the tip of the iceberg--from my own personal experiences with my type 2 diabetic father in the hospital, getting insulin right is a total nightmare.  They use this arbitrary sliding scale which in some cases is totally ineffective and makes for unnecessarily high sugars--I remember how my father was merely 2 days post-op and was sitting there furious because the staff thought it was okay for him to be lying there with sugars in the low 200's, based on their scales and protocols.  
    You've got to stay out of hospitals.
    Great post.
    Adam

  • Anonymous

    10/29/2009 9:57:08 PM |

    Well good luck getting anything "health promoting" while in a hospital!

    Last year, while hospitalized for a bout of Takotsubo syndrome,  they wouldn't let me use my own: fish oil, Vitamin D3, Vitamin K, multi-vitamin, compounded bi-est or progesterone, and so on...

    They did manage to have Armour thyroid available to dispense to me.  Instead of the bi-est and progesterone they offered me Prempro... shudder, and these two meds could be had at the hospitals nifty pharmacy prices.

    So 4 days without the vitamins probably did no harm... but the hormones???  Yikes, by the 2.5 day mark my husband was forced (by me) to become a criminal and smuggle the compounded meds in to me during the night.  What could they do to me that would be worse than hormone withdrawl on top of Takatsubo syndrome?  HA... don't answer that!

    I got better as quickly as I could, and got the Heck out of there.  BTW, I don't think anyone on the nursing staff understood the difference between a heart attack and Takatsubo syndrome... BIG difference!

    Oh... and I got rid of the "precipitating event" that caused the whole thing, and that has greatly de-stressed my life.

    My advice: stay away from hospitals if at all possible... unless you are a doctor, nurse or hospital administrator.

    madcook

  • Jim Purdy

    10/30/2009 6:13:46 AM |

    Great post, and great comments, especially this one from Helena:
    "Well yesterday they called me to tell me that everything was ok, but didn’t understand why I wanted to see my own lab results… the woman I was speaking to almost questioned my motive for wanting to see it. What the heck is wrong here… ???"

    That sounds so familiar. If I could just go directly to a lab without doctor's orders, I would almost drop completely out of the whole doctor and hospital system.

  • renegadediabetic

    10/30/2009 1:07:45 PM |

    I hope I never have to go in the hospital.  They will probably feed me the standard "diabetic diet," low fat-high carb, and send my blood sugar into orbit.

    They do seem very reluctant to tell you the numbers.  After my last blood test, the nurse called and said my cholesterol was "high" and the doctor prescribed simvastatin.  I had to pry the numbers out of her:  LDL - 128, trigs - 55.  I consider the "high" LDL to be a case of skewed freidenwald and haven't bothered with the simvastatin.

  • JPB

    10/30/2009 4:49:49 PM |

    Note to Jim Purdy:  You can get your own tests.  
    www.MedLabUSA.com
    www.MyLab.com
    www.HealthCheckUSA.com (I think the .com is correct but not sure.)

  • Rich S

    10/30/2009 6:53:22 PM |

    Jim-

    Try these self-directed lab test companies:

    www.directlabs.com

    or

    www.privatemdlabs.com

    I've used both of them a lot.  PrivateMDlabs even gives you a 15% discount on top of their reasonable lab test prices.

    Rich

  • Lacey

    10/30/2009 8:19:41 PM |

    JPB,

    You make a good point.  In most states, it is possible for people to go directly to labs.  However, I want to point out that a few states, including NY, prohibit people from dealing directly with labs unless you are a licensed medical practitioner. New Yorkers can't even participate in the Vitamin D project.  It's infuriating, and I think it encroaches on basic liberty.

  • Red Sphynx

    10/31/2009 1:24:19 PM |

    Any guess on how much the hospital charged the insurance company for that single pill of second rate Vit D?

  • Rich S

    10/31/2009 2:09:21 PM |

    Living in New Jersey, I too suffer from "nanny-state" laws which prohibit me from getting my blood drawn for direct-to-consumer testing in New Jersey.

    However, it is perfectly legal to order the tests and get the labwork done at a Labcorp (usually the draw site used) in a neighboring, less-restrictive state.

    I am fortunate to live in southern New Jersey 20 miles from Philadelphia, so I get my lab draws by going over the bridge to Pennsylvania.  BTW, the other nanny-states which restrict direct-to-consumer lab tests are New York and Rhode Island.

    New York even restricts "blood-spot" testing (finger-prick) done at home and mailed in, which can be used for HbA1c, vitamin D, and other tests. To get around that, folks have had the tests mailed to friends or family in other states, who then forward it.  Our politicians are truly moronic.

    Rich

  • Helena

    11/1/2009 12:17:41 AM |

    Jim, I am right there with you... and Rich - thanks for the links I will be taking a look at that since I want to make sure I stay in good range without over doing my supplements.

    Thanks Dr Davis for a great post, once again.

  • Ursula

    11/3/2009 6:46:33 PM |

    I'm a little concerned (as an RN), that the RN and the Pharm were under the impression D affected coagulation. Working in managed care, I see a ton of misconception. Im always astounded at how much a non issue nutrition is, with the exception of diabetics, renals, and your bariatric surgery patients. The only places that get it are centers like Memorial Sloan Kettering, taking a whole body approach. But even there, wrong MD on your case, and your sunk. Do not get sick, and if you do, don't try to heal in the average hospital.

  • kc

    12/5/2009 6:04:03 PM |

    I'm allergic to corn so I live in fear of having to be hospitalized. You can't even imagine all the ways they could make me sicker. The worst part is that my own doctor has told me that I couldn't possibly be reacting to a corn derivative because all the corn protein had been processed out. I can almost guarantee that they wouldn't have a medicine to treat me that didn't contain corn.

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