Dr. Davis, would like your thoughts on the Trader Joe's brand Omega-3 Fatty Acids:
1200 mg Fish Oil
400mg EPA
200 DHA
Thanks,
Chris O

I use Pharmax Finest Pure Fish Oil with Essential Oil of Orange from the TYP Marketplace.  I take 1 tablespoon per day to help reduce Lp(a).  Is it better to take this dose at one time or divide it through the day?

In Iceland where I come from we have a really high quality fish oil called Lysi.

In my opinion liquid form is the only real way to take it, with caps you have to take a ridiculous amount to reach the same amount as in a tablespoon.

Plus you have no way of knowing if the fish oil caps are spoiled except to chew them, often they're not even refridgerated in the supermarket.

I remember from an earlier thread that spacing the dose out over the day works better than a big dose once daily. That makes sense, given that you are trying to alter some liver metabolism that goes on around the clock. I've been using the Life Extension capsules, six a day, for several years with pretty good results. It gets my TG from 400+ to about 170. I'm hoping the gram a day of regular niacin I've been taking for a few months helps further and gets my HDL out of the sewer (27). I'll know that in a few days...

Nice tasting Liquid fish oil brand, 1 teaspoon=
1,500 mg EPA
+ 750 mg DHA
----
= 2,250 mg EPA + DHA
+   380 mg other Omega 3
-------
= 2,630 mg. Omega 3/teaspoon
(out of a total fish oil content of 4,400 mg./tsp.)

Canada made "Natural Factors",
"Dr. Michael Murray recommended pharmaceutical grade" says label; extracted
from anchovy/sardine/mackerel;
1 teaspoon stateside cost works out to less than US$1 a teaspoon; each teaspoon has 40 calories, 15 mg cholesterol, total fat 4.5 gr. (being 3.5 gr. polyunsaturated), natural vitamin E and natural orange flavor, no heavy metals/environmental toxins ... I've no financial interest in the product.

What about Carlson's?



http://www.amazon.com/Carlson-Finest-Liquid-Omega-3-Orange/dp/B001LF39S8/ref=wl_it_dp_o?ie=UTF8&coliid=I27QWKFK5P760T&colid=1J0P20X13IM7F

What are your thoughts on Chris Masterjohn's research regarding very low requirements of polyunsaturated fats in the human diet?  High amounts of fish oil would certainly contravene this hypothesis.  I am referring to his position paper, How Essential Are The Essential Fatty Acids?

The best fish oils should be, as expected, in fish. Eat more fish!!!;))

"1 teaspoon Pharmax fish oil, for example, provides an equivalent quantity of omega-3 fatty acids as 6 standard fish oil capsules on a milligram for milligram basis, but more like 8 to 9 capsules when absorption efficiency is factored in."

Color me confused, Dr D. At the moment, I ingest 6 (3, 2x/day) Sam's Club Omega 3 capsules (the ones you recommended in a long-ago post) to obtain the 6 Grams of total DHA and EPA/day. Does your comment I quote above mean that, with the liquid form, I can take less than the equivalent of 6G/day  because of its absorption efficiency? And how much, if yes?

Really, I am sufficiently befuddled that I think even my question is not clear...

Help!

Where can I check if the fish oil is trigyleride form?

uh.. off topic.. when I clicked on my bookmark, to the Heart Scan Blog all of the website except these comments are in what looks like Russian!!  nothing else on my computer is corrupted...anyone else?.. and how do I fix this?  I am on an IMac.

Thanks,
Jeanne

Fixed it!  funny that it was only this website.

on topic- I am very intolerant to anchovies, will Krill oil help me?  can't take ANY fish oil with anchovy.

Thanks

Seeing some confusion here: the ideal active ingredients in fish oil are the EPA mg. & DHA mg. omega 3's. Lables indicate there are other omega 3 oils, plus other non-omega 3 oils in all products and together these are the mg of "fish oil" (product may specify yet another blending oil). Companies make their EPA mg. & DHA mg. concentrations different, incur production costs to make it higher doseage and our purchase price reflects that.

If you have a theraputic goal for intake: it is not so much how much fish oil, but how much you need to take of any one specific product a day to meet your target for total EPA mg. & DHA mg. Omega 3 fatty acids. For a name brand product Doc recommended and gave his daily dose (whether capsule or liquid)he apparently did the math.

Unfortunately I am illergic to fish oils and react badly to them. Not a good way for me to get my omegas so I need an alternative.

Udo' Oil does do a 369 oil that has no fish oils. So far that is the only one I have been able to find I can handle.

best fish oil is no fish oil. Certainly if anyone knew how fish oils were made , they would not take them. It's interesting how dr. Davis says fish oil with no odor are best but those are simply sterilized and deodorized and for a reason so that the taste of smell would not be repulsed. Trust your own gut instead of anyone else I guess. Ray Peat has chronicled data and science behind the dangers and lipid peroxidation of fish oils. Brian Peskin makes a case that these derivative oils are a huge burden for the cells and should never be taken. Naturally such oils are protected by vitamin E and saturated fat but not in these fish oils. Most other literature documents effects of omega 3 on cancer metastasis, just google it.

Now Foods Omega-3 Fish Oil 16.9 fl. oz.
Serving Size: 1 tsp (5 ml)
Servings Per Container: 100
EPA: 740 mg
DHA: 475 mg
Other Omega-3 Fatty Acids: 185 mg
Total Omega-3 Fatty Acids: 1,400 mg

Cost: $19

100% triglyceride form **

** Now Foods 16.9 fl. oz. is the brand I use and I can confirm this is the TG form after a polystyrene test.  (Take a styrofoam cup, place a small amount of fish oil at the bottom of the cup, wait ten minutes, and if it eats through the bottom it's the EE form.)  

I can also attest that I do not suffer from "fish burps" that the EE form is known to cause.

Anonymous about Lp(a)--

We have no formal data on dosing regimens, but I have been advising dividing dose in two, a.m. and p.m. This appears to be working well.

David--

You may be confusing fish oil dose with dose of EPA+ DHA.

Check your label to see EPA + DHA content. This is what you use to dose your fish oil.

Readers

Is Carlsons fish oil the Triglyceride form one?

SVinay:  Carlsons Super Omega-3 Fish Oil is the ethy ester form.

I am currently taking Heart Health Omega-3 1000mg by Swiss Natural Sources.EPA 300 and DHA 200.  I take three capsules daily.  I have also purchased Jamieson's Omega-3 Select with the same EPA DHA content as the Swiss.  The Jamieson's is less fishy smelling and I will switch back to it when I finish the Swiss.  
Canned boneless herring fillets are usually a part of my lunch.  Omega-3 2g.  I also found some canned cod liver.  I'll try it in an egg bake.

For the poster who had a question about Carlson's... the liquid and low-dose caps are natural triglyceride. Their higher concentrate capsules are ethyl ester.

I currently like Barlean's, as it's triglyceride and relatively inexpensive. Their higher concentrates are ethyl ester though, so go for the lower conc. ones if you want the trig form.

I do disagree with Dr. Davis as far as preferring liquid however, due to oxidation issues. I'd recommend the caps instead, and simply chew them, if swallowing capsules bothers you. The caps do offer some extra oxidation protection.

Hi Vlado,
I think so-called
"pharmaceutical" grade fish oil is distilled to seperate out concentrated gradients of "x"% DHA & "x" % EPA in a product. Yes, fish scraps that the oil is extracted from first gets heated, but so is cooked fish. Solvent residues concievably might be in some products; you can inform me of other compounds resistant to purifying out.

1 teaspoon oil = 5 mL. = 200 pharmaceutical size droplets = 4.54 grams .... I, for example, weigh 79,379 grams (175 pounds/79.4 Kg.) and assume a daily teaspoon dose of 4.5 grams fish oil can be metabolized safely. If you've details on how the omega 3's are noxious when added into the diet please explain.

Is my fish oil already peroxidized and/or are ingested omega 3 lipids peroxidized to my detriment at this level? My math shows that one teaspoon for me is 5.7 hundred-thousandths of my body weight; multiplying 0.000057 x 79379 grams that I weigh = 4.5 grams in teaspoon of oil.

Is there any data guiding recommendations on the ratio of EPAHA? I've never come across any primary data on the subject. To the best of my knowledge, the ideal intake and ratio of EPA and DHA remain unknown and a point of contention. I've noticed many fish oils have a 3:2 ratio of EPAHA, but I don't know where that is coming from. I'd love to know your thoughts, Dr. Davis.

I love the brand from www.strongerfasterhealthier.com
They make 5 flavors with zero fish oil taste. My kids ask for it, so it's a big win in our house. The concentration of EPA and DHA towered over even barleans.

Carlson's Super DHA Gems and EPA Gems concentrate capsules are TG form.

Dear Dr Davis

I am looking for a Kosher liquid omega 3 fis oils
I find nutri supreme research
Calories   40

Calories from Fat   40

Total Fat   4.5g    7%**

Cholesterol   18mg   6%**

EPA   950 mg   *

DHA   475 mg   *

Other Omega 3   325 mg   *

Total Omega 3 Fatty Acids   1750 mg

is this ok? or there is something Kosher better?---------------------------------------------

Check out Ascenta! All their fish oil is in triglyceride form.

ascentahealth.com

What is your opinion of Krill Oil?

Dr. Williams, I am wondering what you think of only taking high doses of EPA? See the following article:
http://igennus-hn.com/omega-3-epa-treatment-for-a-heart-condition-news-release/

As I have M.E. (post viral fatigue syndrome) as well as astronomical total cholesterol (great tryglycerides), I''m interested in trying this protocol. Would love your input.

May I ask, what is the optimal serum range for Vit D.  What do you consider too high and what are the undesirable consequences of too much vitamin D?
Thank you kindly -- fantastic blog !

I wonder- do you have a general rule of thumb for a starting dose based on how much the person weighs? I've found that 1,000 IU per 25 lbs of bodyweight seems to generally get it in the ballpark.

The "1000 units per 25 lbs body weight" that Dr. John Cannell suggests does indeed work well, though there is still great variation among individuals.

For that reason, we aim to maintain blood levels of 25-hydroxy vitamin D of 60-70 ng/ml.

can supplementing with D3 negatively impact TSH thyroid levels, causing TSH to increase? I have seen this stated on another blog.  Suggested remedy was to lower intake of D3.  Thanks.

With daily effort your endurance will continue to increase. In no time at all you will be able to sustain 30 minutes of continued activity. Now as you begin to get into better shape you will be on your way to experiencing fast weight loss.

Great article, I'd never known how vitamin D was related to weight loss until now.

But, with all supplements for weight loss it would need to be combined with exercise for best results

I have the same question as Steve: Can increased D3 affect TSH or thyroid in general. I have hashimotos thyroid autoimmune, and have increased my D3 for osteoporosis reasons, but it seems to be affecting my TSH---need less medication to have same levels of normal TSH.  I read that D is good for autoimmune disease.
Thanks for your response!
Kate

Awesome! really very nice article.

I wanted to take more than 4,000iu because I'm obese (11-17-08 level was 64, 8-3-09 level is 55), but my PCP said not to for fear of kidney problems?  I just upped it to 8,000iu.  We'll see - I sure could use help in the weight loss arena.

Though the levels of vitamin d and weight loss seem to be correlated, is it always true.

Dr. Davis
(Probably not the right forum to post this comment but I just had to send this to you)

Not many weeks ago a colleague of mine (let’s call him Eric) asked me if I knew the difference between D2 and D3 and I told Eric that D2 comes from irradiated mushrooms and D3 comes from the wool. In other words D3 is the same kind of vitamin as humans get from the sun. Humans just don’t get enough and we can’t produce it on our own, like the sheep can. (D3 is natural for humans, D2 is not just like you have said)

After telling Eric this, he asked me how he would know what he is taking and I gave him the medical definitions of them both (D2 = Ergocalciferol; D3 = Cholecaliciferol). Since I was aware of that he had gotten his Vitamin D by prescription I told him “I am 99.9% sure that you are taking D2, but I would be thrilled to find out I am wrong”.

Eric called his pharmacy right away and got the answer I was expecting: Ergocalciferol. When confronting the person Eric was talking to the answer he got back was that Ergocalciferol is the only Vitamin D they are giving out.

A week later, Eric had a new appointment with his doctor and decided to ask him about the D2/D3 issue. The doctor said he knew that there was a difference in them both, but could not say what, not even the basic facts I mentioned above. But the doctor stamped a post-it with what he had sent to the pharmacy just to show Eric… “Vitamin D3; 50,000IU tab” is what the stamp said.

Eric, off course, got confused and was starting to believe that the Pharmacy had made a mistake by giving him Ergocalciferol (D2) since the doctor had given him D3, or at least that is what was stamped on the little note he had.

Today, after getting a refill of his Vitamin D he also got and kept all his paperwork that came along with it. Still in believe about that stamp the doctor had given Eric earlier he asked me to double and triple check that my definition of D2 and D3 was correct. I did, just for my own sanity, and I was still right.

One of the sheets Eric brought me today was the “Patient Education Monograph” sheet stating the drugs and how to use it and so on… The thing the jumped out the most to me was this:

Generic Name: Vitamin D – Oral
Common Brand name(s): Drisdol, Maximum D3
Identification: PA140 Green Oval Capsule

This is the Drug Eric was given: Vitamin D 1.25 MG softgel; Generic name: Ergocalciferol

My researching mind went into high concentration mood and I started to dig. And this is what I found:

The brand name Drisdol is Ergocalciferol (D2), not D3. The Brand name Maximum D3 seems to be hard to find out there in cyber space as a brand name. But the ones I found that was called Maximum D3 seems to be the real stuff, however none of them required a prescription.

When trying to find out through the identification number on the pills (PA140) I now know for sure that Eric is taking Vitamin D2 and not the preferably Vitamin D3. The Brand Name Drisdol had the identification W on one side and D92 on the other, but it is still Ergocalciferol.

The only conclusion I can draw from all this is that the medical industry does not know or care about the difference in D2 and D3 – it is all same to them. And as long as the pharmacies only give out D2 it does not matter what the doctor prescribe anyway.

I knew that people are most likely to be prescribed a D2 pill than to be told to buy over the counter D3. But it was almost heart breaking to see the letter D and number 3 right next to the drug Drisdol as we know is a D2 vitamin. It just didn’t make sense to me that they can be labeled as the same type of medication, when we know it is not!

I love your blog, and I just wanted you to know that I am passing on your information to as many as I can. If you are interesten in seeing any of the documents that I have from this story you can just email me at helena.mathis@hotmail.com

moderator

shouldn't you take helena mathis' email off the blog post ?

This looks interesting.

Good point! I suppose this is true of anything fat-soluble, if you reduce the fat deposit then the concentration will increase?

wow..excelent post, thanks for sharing

thanks for this - with all sorts of info available on the net - this one gives me a greater understanding on vitamin D in relation to my weight loss level. More posts like this

I take calcium with my vitmain D3.  The vitmain D3 I take has olive oil with it.  It is highly advised to take calcium when taking more than 1000 UI daily.  You should get tested for vitamin D3 levels in your blood.  You can get a private lab or do it through a doctor.  I take 1000 UI for every 25 lbs.  I tried taking it a few days that way and I lost 4 lbs in a few days.
You shouldn't take more the recommend amount on the bottle more than a few months.

Thanks Every body for sharing information ....

You really need to consult a doctor if you have any plans to lose weight. Ask for a prescription of the right dosage of Vitamin D and eat nutritious foods as well. Don't forget to exercise too, its helpful.

In my case, I created my own – FatBlasters. It’s essential that you not feel alone, and reaching out to friends (new or old) is typically a smart move. I just heard about PeetTrainer, but didn’t know about it when I began down the road to weight loss. You have to know that others are out there for moral support – they know things that you couldn’t possibly know, and they’ve probably been “in your shoes” at some point in the past (or present). Share stories, laughter, tears, successes, and failures – share them. There are thousands of communities out there, so keep looking until you find the one that fits you.

Nice post on the Vitamin D and weight loss. Overweight is one of the major problem in the world. People do lot of things for losing the weight.

What is suggested here is that if you start out with an inadequate vitamin D level, it’s possible that this might inhibit or impede your ability to lose weight on a reduced caloric diet?

yes my dear friend ,definitely you lose weight on a reduced caloric diet, HCG diet , thanks

There is many more information on this post about how to reduce our weight loss and also there is plenty of information about the functions of vitamin D in weight loss.Office plugin Its really a helpful information to all of us.

This is a common phenomenon with substantial weight loss: lose weight and the need for vitamin D is reduced. The reduction in dose is roughly proportion to the weight lost. Vitamin D should therefore be reassessed with any substantial change in weight of, say, 10 lbs or more, either up or down, because of the influence of fat on vitamin D blood levels.

Vitamin D is good for weight loss.

I am now on a weight loss program and I can say that I am getting a very good result. I never thought that vitamin D can really affect my weight loss program.

Thanks for sharing the importance of vitamin D in loosing the weight. keep posting such a nice post....



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